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11-12-2002, 10:03 AM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]I was just wondering what was more important speed or looks to you guys?[/color:post_uid0]

MrShadow
11-12-2002, 08:27 PM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]I wouldn't say "Speed", rather "Performance". It's better if you can smoke this smart ass prick in his WRX STi in a car that looks like the one your grandad drives to the shops and church. It's called a "Sleeper".

That's what I'd prefer. Besides, people can go overboard with looks:

Rice Boy Page (http://www.riceboypage.com)[/color:post_uid0]

BigMal
11-12-2002, 08:48 PM
[color=#000000:post_uid1]For me performance.
I just love driving the car its so much fun. *I don't even
care if I can beat anybody or not its all about just having
fun round the bendy stuff. *2nd would be stereo again for
my own personal enjoyment and lastly looks. *It is a buzz
to have people come up to you and say nice car, most
then say what is it ?? but that buzz is not even close to
the buzz I get from driving it.

Regards

Mal[/color:post_uid1]

MrShadow
11-12-2002, 09:08 PM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]Good point about the stereo Mal. That's also gotta perform well.[/color:post_uid0]

bRaDiNhO
12-12-2002, 06:23 AM
[color=#FF0000:post_uid0]Handling first. Ok, fine, the Astina aint no GTR. But for the money i was looking at, it handled better than a 205GTi, ROlla SX, Alfa 33 Cloverleaf, Celica, or Silvia. I love just driving down a twisty road at high speed. I dont push it too much so that im understeering every corner, but enough to get the odd movement makes it fun enuff. Nothing beats a good hard drive.

Interior. And ill include an orright stereo in that. Thats where i am, so why not enjoy it?

Then looks and straight line performance. Both have to be at least orright, but neither have to be outstanding. I have as much fun in the 92kw AStina as i do in a 230kw Commodore. Astina could be considered 'nippy'. Wont beat an STi, but it does fine in the fun factor.[/color:post_uid0]

O-LYM-PIC
12-12-2002, 06:45 AM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]depends alot on the car- with the astina, the preformance is just closely followed by the looks, while with the rx7, it'l b more about performance- less 4 the looks.

overall

straight line performance, not speed as much as acceleration. in the city u dont need speed, u just do the short bursts. thats why im goin rotor.

next would b handlin- its gota go where i point it!!!

im not all that overly concerned with stereo, id rather have a nice BOV and scare the **** outa pedestrians.

these r just my priorities.[/color:post_uid0]

sik astina
12-12-2002, 07:17 AM
[color=#0000FF:post_uid0]Personally, I care more about looks than speed at the moment.... maybe that'll change the day I go turbo :;): :cool: Sound system is important too, get that deep bass into ya :p


-Mick[/color:post_uid0]

Sandyman
12-12-2002, 07:26 AM
[color=#FF0000:post_uid0]u say astina not camparable to gtr? i think yes, my friend. kikarse handling!

u can't go wrong with performance. what would u prefer? the look of jelousy on some mates faces when u show up in an astina wiv sweet bodykit, or the look of shock on the face of some guy in a wrx u pull up beside at some traffic lights, and kik his arse in a car with no visible work?

I'll take the look of shock on the face of the bloke in the wrx thanx :)[/color:post_uid0]

sik astina
12-12-2002, 07:30 AM
[quote:post_uid0="Sandyman"][color=#000000:post_uid0]u can't go wrong with performance. what would u prefer? the look of jelousy on some mates faces when u show up in an astina wiv sweet bodykit, or the look of shock on the face of some guy in a wrx u pull up beside at some traffic lights, and kik his arse in a car with no visible work?

I'll take the look of shock on the face of the bloke in the wrx thanx :)[/color:post_uid0][/quote:post_uid0]
[color=#0000FF:post_uid0]Why not both? :D :cool:[/color:post_uid0]

O-LYM-PIC
12-12-2002, 07:41 AM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]talkin about this, i always thought that even with the engine swap to turbo in an astina, u'd still have not much chance against most other performance cars.

not because of power output, but because of the dodgy fwd. just the fact that they are rwd or awd gives them the advantage, rite?? im under the impression that there is pretty much noway that a turbod astina can beat, lets say a warmed over wrx or 200sx.

am i on the rite track here, or doesnt the fwd set u back that far. ive never driven a well setup turbo fwd car, but i no that i love the way a 200 drives, with only modest work done.

havin said all this, i just thought about the type r's. a fwd car that will challange a rwd or awd turbo, so maybe the astina aint that bad of a thing

what do u boys with the turbo astinas say. any time slips, or experiences at lights?? always wondered about this ???[/color:post_uid0]

Sandyman
12-12-2002, 07:54 AM
[color=#FF0000:post_uid0]:( ur making us sad man. maybe if u extended the bonnet, put in the 2.5 litre, gave it a supercharger, nos, lotsa engine management ****, and nothing on the outside...u could beat em!

Astina not quite my destiny car anyway, although it is a very good car.

mine is the '69 vette. have to rip apart the suspension and steering stuff and replace all of it :p[/color:post_uid0]

MrShadow
12-12-2002, 08:27 PM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]Well, you're gonna have to ask Rupe about smokin WRX's (when he gets his car back that is). Apparently, after his suspension work, he was told by somebody that it handles as well as, if not better than a stock WRX (correct me if I'm wrong Rupe).[/color:post_uid0]

Rupewrecht
13-12-2002, 01:06 AM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]yeah, i've been told it handles a lot bettter that a standard my00 WRX. well, the hardtop anyway :;):

but FWD is not necessarity a disadvantage. A stock Integra Type r will outhandle a Stock 200SX. the real disadvantage is traction! :p

assume you have a FWD car and an AWD car, both with the same power and assuming all other things are equal. in a drag race, the FWD will lose ground off the starting line, but by the end of the quarter mile it will more than likely be ahead of the AWD car. the simple reason is drivetrain loss.

with an AWD car the power has to go to all 4 wheels, whereas the FWD only has to power 2 wheels. conventional drivetrain loss (the loss from flywheel hp to driving-wheels hp) has a AWD at about 40%, but the FWD at 20% loss. so therefore it takes less power to be just as fast in a FWD

did any of that make sense?[/color:post_uid0]

Sandyman
13-12-2002, 01:11 AM
[color=#FF0000:post_uid0]it made enough sense. thats all that matters.[/color:post_uid0]

O-LYM-PIC
13-12-2002, 01:15 AM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]yeah yeah i understand that,, that would be the reason they really dont use awd's in track races.

but still i think the type r may handle better then the 200, but in terms of straight line performance, the 200 is still ahead. the only real diff is the rwd compared to the fwd. kw to weight is fairly similar, while the 200 has much greater potential (mainly due to the turbo and the rwd givin greater traction)

i'd like 2 know how ur astina goes rupe when u get it back.[/color:post_uid0]

BigBoyLemonade
13-12-2002, 01:17 AM
[color=#006666:post_uid0]FWD isnt that much of a disadvantage.. its the gearbox in the astina that lets us down...

Geoff Turbo astina has been known to rip done up wrx's and 200's... put an exhaust, front mount, boost, rebuilt turbo or aftermarket one and it should run at least 13.5sec 1/4...

traction is drivers fault... not whether its FWD or RWD. AWD does have its advantages but a fwd will have less power loss through the drive train at the end of the 1/4 so it does make up in the end...

RWD is best for dragging but it has to be setup right too... stock suspension dont cut the mustard[/color:post_uid0]

Rupewrecht
13-12-2002, 01:23 AM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]after all that i forgot to say what was more important!

i bought the hardtop coz i think it looked dead sexy, and i still do. at the time it seemed quite fast enough...but that feeling disappeared after about 2 months....but anyway...in order of preference

Looks, Performance...at the moment... :;):[/color:post_uid0]

MrShadow
13-12-2002, 01:44 AM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]That made sense to me Rupe, now I can feel safe in gettting a turbo conversion! I was concerened about the FWD, but now no problems! Well, um there IS the issue of money...... :([/color:post_uid0]

bRaDiNhO
13-12-2002, 07:02 AM
[color=#FF0000:post_uid0]wat have u done to suspension rupe?[/color:post_uid0]

BigMal
13-12-2002, 08:58 AM
[color=#000000:post_uid1]Do the conversion Shadow, you wont be dissapointed overall.
After almost 3 years the cost factor now is only a coupla
grand a year which is probably less than my grog spend a
year.
You do need a good suspension package to get it to
perform at its best. I have raced a S2000 hard through
the royal nasho and he could not lose me at all and he's
got more power, better brakes but I could corner harder.

Lastly dissagree a FWD will win if the 2 cars have the same
weight and power because of less drivetrain loss.

Regards

Mal[/color:post_uid1]

O-LYM-PIC
13-12-2002, 07:51 PM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]yeah but does a fwd car have less drive train loss then a rwd??? i though they were the same, because its still just the 2 wheels running instead of the 4 in the awd.so the considering that, wouldnt the rwd have the obvious advantage?? and dont they have greater options in suspension setup?? just try push all the weight to the back. in a fwd car do u just turn that around and push it 2 the front??
questions, questions, questions

:D :cool: ???[/color:post_uid0]

Rupewrecht
13-12-2002, 08:19 PM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]my suspension mods:

Koni sport shocks
ground control coilover sleeves
whiteline rear swaybar
whiteline front strut brace
adjustable camber bolts f+r
front offset bushes
rear poly bushes

think thats all!

And i know two guys with TX3 turbos - one with a AWD one with FWD. similar mods, and the FWD always catches up at the end of a drag. But actually you're right because the FWD would be lighter coz it doesn't have the weight of the AWD system...doh :(

i *think* that RWD apparently has more drivetrain loss that a FWD, simply because it's got more moving parts for the power to be transferred through. but not positive on that.

with AWD you'll always be behind the 8 ball i think, because traction is the big problem (and after driving my car last night on 7psi it sure as hell IS a problem LOL) but once you get going, things become a big more equal. it's not as drastic as everbody makes out in my experience.

and don't forget they have FWDs in the 8's for the quarter mile in the US...just as quick[/color:post_uid0]

BigMal
13-12-2002, 08:53 PM
[color=#000000:post_uid1]FWD has less drive train loss because there is less drivetrain.
For a rear wheel drive you have clutch, gearbox, tailshaft
and diff. *Each having an effect on the loss but the main
extra being obviously the diff. The use of clutch packs for LSD
or even the open wheeler centre loses power when converting
a sideways movement of the tailshaft to a forward movement
of the wheels. *RWD rule of thumb is 60% loss between
flywheel to the wheels and FWD is 40%.

Dan,
* * *Your front offset bushes that was for the anti-lift wasn't
it. *Whiteline only fitted straight for me saying the bottom
wishbone was already horizontal so there wasn't a need. *Just
needed the urethane bush to stop flex. *To add an offset
would cause nose dive ?? *
You may want to turn the rear koni's a little harder to
stop the front from coming up as much now you have the
turbo motor going. *Will make the ride a little harder but
will help with traction. *Whiteline have a yahoogroups list
so you can email and ask for their recomended setting for
the koni's. *I also have my alignment chart from their last
setting can tell you their recomendations for that as it is
very good with little torque steer under boost.

Regards

Mal[/color:post_uid1]

Rupewrecht
13-12-2002, 09:10 PM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]the front offset bushes was to correct my car pulling to the left, and it did actually fix it. weird.

and my springs are so so hard i probably wont need to do that! LOL but i intend to raise the rear a little to help.

haven't really driven the car enough to notice the torque steer, but it didn't seem like much at all. the power delivery seems pretty smooth -no sudden harsh rush to power. but it was still spining the wheels pretty much right thru first![/color:post_uid0]

IZG-00D
13-12-2002, 09:25 PM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]we all have own different opinion...
i myself , right now own's both the astina hatch (still for sale) and the S15. they both WON CAR OF THE YEAR and both have the nice body shape.
before i bought the nissan, i had a choice between a integra type r (new) or the S15 (new). after alot of research and window shopping and alot of peer pressure from friends, ended up buying the S15 for the reasons of looks, price and specially performance TURBO.
type r may have the exact same engine power as the S15 (147kw) but the S15 has alot more torque. plus type r is too pricey ($43 orc with NO air-con). in the end, i can just upgrade my suspension to match the type r.
now, about the question between looks or performance.... i would have to go for both. ALL GO ALL SHOW!!![/color:post_uid0]

BigMal
13-12-2002, 10:19 PM
[color=#000000:post_uid1]Sorry Dan, you did tell me that before. *I have a shocking
short term memory problem. *I forget what has caused it too.
Are your Koni's set all the way to soft and then half to 3/4
turn to hard. *I think thats all they need when new. *There
is an article on the whiteline page about setting them.

Regards

Mal[/color:post_uid1]

Rupewrecht
13-12-2002, 10:22 PM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]LOL hey no worries. yeah they're still set at softest setting. and i'll go have a squizz :)[/color:post_uid0]

MAztinA 323
04-03-2006, 11:51 AM
Sandyman:
u can't go wrong with performance. what would u prefer? the look of jelousy on some mates faces when u show up in an astina wiv sweet bodykit, or the look of shock on the face of some guy in a wrx u pull up beside at some traffic lights, and kik his arse in a car with no visible work?


i would soo go for wrx shock face!!!! when ur at the lights, i dont think looks are anywhere near as important as say, acting rice with the stereo up around parramatta.

and i loove beating people that have a little bit too much attitude with my very stock looking bg (minus undercar blue neons, which are not turned on on the road anyways) :D :D

bourbon
04-03-2006, 11:53 AM
OMG talk about bringin back a dead thread :p haha... 3years late :D


but performance > appearance

people who just look after appearance dont have the money to make the car perform so they spend the money on the extertior to make it look like it goes fast... alot more people doin that now days cause of insurance :p