DIY: Spring change

[anditz]

Hey guys,

Has anybody taken the stock shocks apart them selves? Is there much preload on the springs or can i just take them apart by resting my foot on the coil (strut lying down) and removing the top nut?

[Cosmo Dude]

If you take apart the standard spring/shock without compressing the spring you will have a fun game of find the nut. Putting lower springs back in is rather easy as long as the shocks have not collapsed and you've found the nut.

[Rupewrecht]

No, you will need spring compressors. Unless you undo the top shaft nut while they're still in the car.

[smurfy]

Just compress them :) simple and easyy

[anditz]

^ not if you dont have the clamp lol

[anditz]

And should i add the same amount of preload on to the new coil not?

[xeon8]

^ not if you dont have the clamp lol

Well if you have the clamps you can compress them and make the spring change a whole lot easier, as stated before ;)

[TheMAN]

if you want to end up dead or in the hospital, go ahead and take the springs off the struts without compressors

however, if you value your life, get spring compressors and do it! If you aren't confident doing this, ask for help or have this done by professionals.... this is one of those things you want to be very careful with!

[Clean_Cookie]

I tried this mate, and it doesn't work at all safely. I used those ratchet straps, and it worked well for removing the nut but actually releasing the tension was a totally different story. Do not try it. Took mine into Jarred who had the right stuff.

[SP-20-DB]

U can get the clamps at most auto shops ie repco auto barn peps. n just gotta load the spring up till u can feel it takingthe force off the strut top. then to replace the lowered springs u may need to compress them to install just depends how low u go. king springs super lows dont need to be compressed as i had them before i got the coil overs

[Duke]

Spring compressors are dangerous! If you arnt confident, don't do it, take it to a shop

[anditz]

ok so some good news and bad news. good news is i think these shocks have been replaced before, they are kyb excel g shocks - are they standard?

bad news is, they were installed by a moron, nuts on the top of the strut are a/ super tight (struggle with a breaker bar) and rounded off. so i have to cut about 5 of the nuts off with a chisel :/

any ideas?

[TheMAN]

not installed by a moron... just installed by someone who used an impact gun
there's no way to round off fasteners unless you're using the wrong tools
6 point sockets won't round them off

[anditz]

shocks should not have that tension on the nuts, lucky they weren't threaded - he is a moron.

[TheMAN]

they would if the springs weren't compressed

[smurfy]

Use a rattle gun to get them off. Otherwiae youll be there for hours making them worse...same thing happened to mine. member to change the nuts afterwards so it doesnt happen again

[TheMAN]

yeah... no one uses hand tools to do these, that's why they're over torqued!
I still think calling whoever last worked on it is a bit undeserving :)

those nuts are meant to be one time use anyway

[anditz]

egh managed to get them all off with a hammer and chisel, will go get some replacement nuts tomorrow, car is lowered though, looks and drives well :) i do get slight scrubbing under full braking and sharp turning, but otherwise all is well. will upload some photos tomorrow as i just finished now!

[anditz]

and also, it doesn't matter what everyone does or doesnt do, shocks should not be put on with a rattle gun, they should be torqued correcty.

[TheMAN]

so it appears you know all about mechanic work, so I guess you don't need our help then

glad you have you got everything taken cared of!

[anditz]

i have enough knowledge to know when something is done incorrectly. alas i'm no mechanic, and appreciate the little tips and pointers this forum provides.

but you go ahead and rattle gun 14mm nuts to one of the most crucial parts of your vehicle xo

[rodhog]

Well Just for your information. It's not only INDUSTRY STANDARD. It's Accepted by the MTA. It's done by Majority of workshops around the world.

One of the reason you use an impact is because like most ROTATING parts that need torque applied to them. It can only be achived with impact applications due to the Lack of a Reverse locking of the Shaft.

On all replacement struts they are only a one time Nut type. Desgined to be impacted on.
If your thinking you can get enough torque on there with a bar Good fine.
But when they come out of the factory torqued up with Rattle gun or even Via Machines off an assembly line. I don't you find it will effect it at all.

[BG1.8sp]

100% agree with this ...
Just out of curiosity I did my strut tops up with a torque wrench... Was basically useless, as stated there was just no were near enough reverse locking on the shaft to be able to get anywhere near the torque needed.
So I pulled the rattle gun out. Definitely the better way to do it.
Also, just because you are using a rattle gun doesn't mean it's ridiculously over torqued. I was using a rattle gun all day every day basically, and If you know what you are doing and how to adjust the main line air pressure, an the regulator on the gun properly depending on what torque is required, it is quite easy to get it nearly spot on every time. Does need practice tho, and every rattle gun is different.

Note: most Top nuts have a nylock on it to, which makes it particularly difficult to get the correct torque using a wrench, as the shaft will just turn. Hence why a rattle gun would be recommended

Well Just for your information. It's not only INDUSTRY STANDARD. It's Accepted by the MTA. It's done by Majority of workshops around the world.

One of the reason you use an impact is because like most ROTATING parts that need torque applied to them. It can only be achived with impact applications due to the Lack of a Reverse locking of the Shaft.

On all replacement struts they are only a one time Nut type. Desgined to be impacted on.
If your thinking you can get enough torque on there with a bar Good fine.
But when they come out of the factory torqued up with Rattle gun or even Via Machines off an assembly line. I don't you find it will effect it at all.

[anditz]

I had no problem getting enough torque out of the bar. if it wasn't for the rounded nuts, i would have been fine (there was one nut that didn't slip). and if nuts are being rounded doesn't that say the mechanic who put them on is a moron anyway?

looks like i'll have to stand corrected on the rattle gun *redface*

anyway i didn't come here to fight i'm just glad i was able to do the job, without a rattle gun.

[TheMAN]

they wouldn't be rounded if a hex shaped socket was used instead of a star shaped one ;)

[anditz]

yeah i know! just to clarify i'm not the one who rounded them, they were like that when i started.

[TheMAN]

there are of course special tools to remove rounded off nuts and bolts... I got a set... was worth the money
doesn't work 100% of course, but it usually does :)

[BG1.8sp]

Haha yeah that's true... That's generally my rule... Don't use a rattle gun unless you have to :p
Even though I alway use them at work, never at home.
And yes I would say that the person who put them in was a moron. Not because he rounded the nuts (Spose if you are in a rush it happens or not using the right tools), but because they didnt change the nuts that were rounded.
Glad u got the job done safely btw.

[anditz]

yeah i have those lock socket things, they didnt work!

Thanks BG

also, are those plastic slip things that sit in between the top plate and the body important? i forgot to put one of them back on (might affect my ride height lol :P )

and i'm getting a sharp squeaky noise over small bumps from the rear left, when there is load on the shock (ie heavy cornering or passengers) it is silent. thoughts?

[BG1.8sp]

I have one thought... Get some silicone spray and spray a light film on the shaft of the shock.
Mine was squeaking a little after I cleaned ad scrubbed my inner wheel arches.

And I can't think of a "plastic slip thing" lol
Have a better description or a pic? Will jog my memory :p

[anditz]

http://i40.tinypic.com/10mvksh.png

ok so bad drawing i know, but that thing on the right resembles the plastic film/slip that sat on top of the strut top plate. i guess to prevent metal on metal contact? is it necessary?

[TheMAN]

yeah i have those lock socket things, they didnt work!

Thanks BG

also, are those plastic slip things that sit in between the top plate and the body important? i forgot to put one of them back on (might affect my ride height lol :P )

and i'm getting a sharp squeaky noise over small bumps from the rear left, when there is load on the shock (ie heavy cornering or passengers) it is silent. thoughts?

did you tap those sockets into the rounded nuts really hard with a hammer? you can't just place them on top without forcing them on... without doing that, they're ineffective

as for the film... yes, it's important, otherwise mazda would have saved 10 cents on the part... preventing metal to metal contact, yes... that's it's job... it's to prevent squeaking and rattling noises

[BG1.8sp]

Ohh, that plastic slip... Yeah to stop squeaks as sai above.
Nice drawing :p

[anditz]

cool well hopefully that's the problem, ill touch base tomorrow...or to do it now hmmmmmmm

[TheMAN]

other cause of squeeks are from the top hat bearings... they always should be replaced when you change the shocks out because they're cheap plastic crap that just breaks over time

I also apply liberal amounts of silicone grease inside the bump stops to keep them from making noise also

[rodhog]

As for the rounded nuts.

One of the reasons for this is normally lack of Quality or NEW tools.

HEx shaped should be used on RATTLE Guns because it's the only way a IMPACT type driver socket should be made. Cheap Chinese types do come in the multi point type but are just crap. But when you consider the cost difference.
A cheap chinese Impact set from say supercheap that is out of Spec by up to 0.4mm. compared with say a a decent brand might be made in china but retail is about $100
Then you have Hi-end like a snap-on blue point I think last time cost in the $200 mark.
Of course there are some even more cray stuff but.

You then have to think - How many workshops actually carry, the correct tools.
A up to date work shop will have ALL THE TOOLS. from not just right size but everything including tools to re-set engine lights etc. It's not uncomon to find workshops having to share or set jobs to over places. Or even refusing work, because they don't have the correct tools. Even spares are not uncommon today.

Certain BMW's have globes you cna JUST get to but as of yet No aftermarket supplier is making them common.
Or even for example you own a SAAB - your ****ED. Certain parts yes others well I know it's a BIT hard currently to get a Keys re-done for them. I'm sure someone has but I understand some are holding ransom on them.

SO untill someone starts doing the full supply of parts again many small workshops won't bother with them. Much like they don't replace worn out tools too often.

[anditz]

yeah interesting post^ i've had previous problems, finding threaded bolts from when bushes were replaced, so i'm just thinking the previous owners mechanic was careless. one of the bolts was completely f**ked and he just grinded taper on the end and bashed it in - luckily the threads on the sub frame weren't damaged and i was able to replace it. that's why i jumped in and called this guy a moron - guess i was just frustrated!

good news is that i put the plastic slips in, gave all the struts a lick of silicon grease and the squeaks are gone :)