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-=SP20=-
14-11-2002, 02:54 AM
[color=#000000:post_uid9]Hi,
I was wondering whether any of you guys have or know of anyone in Aus who's beefed up their SP20 yet?

I've seen a ****e load of turbo'd SP20's in the states, and have read about a few guys running NOS etc... plus some people running the mazdaspeed cams 'n pistons, but they're limited in the states by very strict emission laws, so most people take the easy way out and buy a bolt on turbo kit...

I was looking at a set-up along these lines:
• J-SPEC 2.0 FS-ZE Piston set
• J-SPEC 2.0 FS-ZE intake camshaft
• MAZDASPEED Exhaust camshaft
• Haltech e6k programmable ecu
• PACEMAKER 4-2-1 headers and 02 sensor relocation
• hi-flow 2.25" catylitic converter
• mandrel bent 2.25" cat back exhaust
• HiTech 2.25" bazooka muffler
• K&N Panel Filter

I know I can get everything but the pistons,cams & ecu in Oz.

I could get the J-Spec and Mazdaspeed stuff from corksport in the US, but the way our dollar is it would work out more expensive than a turbo kit...

Do any of you guys know how I could get this stuff in Aus or direct from Japan?

Thanks in Advance :D[/color:post_uid9]

Critter
14-11-2002, 08:09 AM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]Not sure I can help on supply apart from you already have a handle on....

You know my thoughts re some of that stuff (pm)

The Pacemaker headers is an interesting subject. Was told by a zorst header manufacturer that headers in this car are a problem.
Was a story about that 3 cars were done and they glazed the pistons after 10k owing to ECU trying to run too hot. I guess the relocated O2 sensor is to deal with that but have you got info on this coz would like headers but no options it had seemed......[/color:post_uid0]

-=SP20=-
14-11-2002, 11:31 PM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]I wonder whether the Haltech ecu would fix that problem?
they're quite pricy though $1200US

I also like the mazdaspeed headers available for our car...
you can get them as an option in Japan, so they must have figured out a way of placing the o2 sensors in a good position?
but from the looks of the list below it may be a new o2 sensor all together

[img:post_uid0]http://dominos.edgetech.com.au/images/ms_headers.jpg[/img:post_uid0]

I got this info off a protege FAQ site Protege FAQ (http://web2.airmail.net/emann/protegefaq/)

Here are the part numbers/all the parts you need to get/install the MazdaSpeed header:
Header: QBJ1-13-450
Clip: B214-34-C10
Clip: E356-18-141
O2 sensor: FS9P-18-861
Coupler bracket: FS9P-18-998
Bolt (set of 2): 9979-40-612

You may also want to get the heat shield to keep your engine bay cooler and reduce heat soaking. You can get this heat shield off of a 48 state 98-00 626. The part number is FS01-13-390B. The heat shield bolt part number is 9079-40-612. You will need a total of 7 bolts.[/color:post_uid0]

Toyboy
15-11-2002, 05:04 AM
[color=#000000:post_uid11]You's guys have me worried know,i have Hurricane extractors on my Astina,and the o2 sensor is only reading off no 2/3 cylinders which could have detrimental affects on the engine in its later life,from what a mechanic told me :(
Do you think i should get the sensor relocated where the pipes join all together ??? i imagine this could be a costly excercise as i would need a new sensor to start with,that was long enough to reach the new location :angry: Hmmmmmmmmm what to do,
I have done over 20,000km with this setup :(

* Catch ya's :)[/color:post_uid11]

-=SP20=-
15-11-2002, 08:38 PM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]hrmm would be worth looking at?[/color:post_uid0]

-=SP20=-
15-11-2002, 08:41 PM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]anyways, after talking to critter I'm thinking turbo :)[/color:post_uid0]

Critter
20-11-2002, 01:25 AM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]I'm thinking turbo too....:)
Will get it "turbo-ready" and then I'm thinking mebbe borrow something for a month while surgery goes on (Croydon says 3-4 weeks to do it).

Patience is a difficult thing to master.......[/color:post_uid0]

EZZY
20-11-2002, 02:37 AM
[color=#000080:post_uid0]hey critter, maybe you should count how many cars jim has at croydon!?!
from my past experience, i dont think they will have your can done in 3 - 4 weeks.
dont get me wrong though, they do good jobs but they takes too too long and very expensive.
a friend of mine had a crx, already turbo'd with american bolt ons, went to jim and got the forgies and ecu done, guess what, it took them more than 6 months.[/color:post_uid0]

kyra
21-11-2002, 04:02 AM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]and i'll just sit back and see how you boys go with your modifications... see what works and what doesn't work as well... esp turbo kits...
oh yeah, any solid figures on the turbo kit from croydon critter???
are any of you guys running 18's on the sp20's?

cheers,
Bill[/color:post_uid0]

Rupewrecht
21-11-2002, 04:12 AM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]workshops may [b:post_uid0]say[/b:post_uid0] that a job takes a certain time...but with custom installs, plenty of unexpected things can come up :;):[/color:post_uid0]

Critter
22-11-2002, 03:20 AM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]Thereby "hangs a tail" dunnit?

Would LOVE to do the BOOST thing but time is the killer mostly....

ANYBODY got any thoughts on this? Who/where etc? The logistics is killing me here, the will is strong....[/color:post_uid0]

EZZY
22-11-2002, 03:58 AM
[color=#000080:post_uid0]dan.... are you speaking of your experience(s)?[/color:post_uid0]

Rupewrecht
22-11-2002, 04:08 AM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]LOL just maybe! :;):

*cough* 3 weeks *cough* thats turned into 6 so far...[/color:post_uid0]

EZZY
22-11-2002, 04:12 AM
[color=#000080:post_uid0]give them another 3 week matey! :D
aiming for the boxing day debut?[/color:post_uid0]

Rupewrecht
22-11-2002, 04:15 AM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]LOL i'm aiming for next week! :O[/color:post_uid0]

EZZY
22-11-2002, 04:32 AM
[color=#000080:post_uid0]just thought of a perfect way for you to run the engine in.... drive up to sydney and back![/color:post_uid0]

BigMal
22-11-2002, 05:10 AM
[color=#000000:post_uid1]Critter for you with the unichip already its not a big job.
Select the turbo. *Have a manifold made up and the
appropriate exhaust and intake piping & I/C. *After you have
the turbo all should be able to be done by an exhaust
shop eg Liverpool, or Tuffy, or Bay Mufflers who did my
exhaust. *Then buy a recirculating BOV eg EVO5 as it
will be easier to run the car with for fueling but wont
have the noise. *Can talk to you about the exact details
on the weekend mate.

Regards

Mal[/color:post_uid1]

BigMal
22-11-2002, 05:13 AM
[color=#000000:post_uid1]Just to chip in my conversion took 3 weeks. 1 week lost
due to a wrong clutch being sent. I organised all the
parties and had the tow truck organised to move it.
The shops will take their sweet time you know it but
its not rocket science and half the time they farm the
work out anyway.

Regards

Mal[/color:post_uid1]

Critter
22-11-2002, 08:53 PM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]Mal, expect a long and detailed conversation about it on the weekend buddy :)[/color:post_uid0]

adelaidesp20
07-12-2002, 09:01 AM
[color=#000000:post_uid5]Finally others looking at suping up their SP20's.
I am hoping to post some more photos as soon as i get my works' digital camera, but in the meantime check out the header pic www.chariot.net.au/~sp20.
Engine noise after header install was reminiscent of an Alfa.
Anyone know where I can get cheap 17" or 18" ATIX6 rims in Adelaide ?
If anyone is interested in Pacemaker headers, check them out in the yellow pages here in Adelaide as the phone number doesnt come to hand but ask for Mike Richter. My test header should be ready in a months time for productions models to be made up so put your order in soon for early 2003 availability. I'm thinking of having final set ceramic coated. Not worried about a heat shield as the airflow from the front grill keeps the engine and headers cooled down better.
Believe me the gains from the long tube 4-2-1 header with the first cat removed is an excellent increase in performance. Prior i wa sgetting to 9.5/9.6 secs to 100kmh but now am getting to 8.7/8.8's all from a gain of probably 8-10Kw. But the pulling power in the middle to high revs is where the gains are.
Only downside is now fuel consumption is down from 11.4km a litre to 11.3km litre (big deal..not!) and on a cold morning burning a rich fuel mixture until the engine warms up (due to the first cat being removed.
Also at idle the car vibrates more tha usual. Does any one have any ideas to remedy this ? In USA forums they reckon sparko plugs and wires do the trick. Any thoughts ?

Claude[/color:post_uid5]

Sandyman
09-12-2002, 05:59 AM
[color=#00FF00:post_uid0]Question For "=SP20=":

How does the stock sp20 drive? could u compare it to the v6 hatch of 93-97?[/color:post_uid0]

Critter
09-12-2002, 07:52 PM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]adelaidesp20
Welcome aboard mate :)

Of course us SP20 owners will be VERY interested in what you have done there. :)
I gather these will be a Pacemaker stock item available from any Pacemaker dealer?

Given that the first cat is removed, is there any issue legality-wise? (I understand 2 are used in a "something to do with California" kinda thing).
Also are O2 sensor(s) changed/moved and how does the system cope with this?
Details keenly sought.......:)[/color:post_uid0]

TDK
09-12-2002, 10:26 PM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]I have been told by Hi-tech headers in melbourne that you would be crazy to put extractors on a SP20. They had 3 test SP20's and after 10,000km all 3 of them blew the engines from overheating. He said the the computer needs heat readings from both cats. If you remove one then the computer gets incorrect readings. after a while the internals of the engines deteriorate and the engine dies. He also said that there isn't enough room to have extractors and also keep the cat. I'll provide the phone number for Hi-tech Headers, anyone thats in the know-how should ring them and ask for themselves. I don't know much about how engines work and stuff to really understand what he was saying, so hopefully those that can understand should give them a ring and find out once and for all what our position is on the matter of headers. If you can also explain it to the rest of us then it would be much appreciated.
TDK[/color:post_uid0]

TDK
09-12-2002, 10:47 PM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]Hi-Tech Exhausts Pty Ltd
17 -19 Cromer Ave Sunshine North 3020
(03) 9312 5066[/color:post_uid0]

Critter
10-12-2002, 09:15 AM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]Ummm, yeah TDK
I heard exactly the same thing about this header application from a different source, something about crazing the bores at 10,000k on all 3 cars.

Which is why I asked the question about how the system coped with the issue of O2 sensors etc. Something about the computer reading too cold and forever trying to heat things up.

I'm thinking the folks at Pacemaker ought to know what they are doing, so am very interested in how a fix has been achieved.[/color:post_uid0]

Toyboy
10-12-2002, 10:47 PM
[color=#000000:post_uid11]I wonder if this problem extends to the BP motors 2 :O Ive had extractors on my motor for 30,000kms now,and nothing mechanically has gone wrong yet(Touch wood)*damn no wood around* :( hehe[/color:post_uid11]

adelaidesp20
15-12-2002, 09:01 AM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]Hi all, thanks for the feedback.
I'll be contacting Pacemaker on Monday to have a chat with Mike and see what his thoughts are on hi-tech headers tests.
Not sure exactly where he relocated the sensors. As mentioned before am taking them back in January to have dies made so they can mass market the headers and yes they should be available through all pacemaker dealers. Though, if there is a problem after 10000kms then we may have to wait longer as i've only covered about 4,000km since the headers were fitted.
Will keep you all posted.[/color:post_uid0]

Critter
16-12-2002, 08:06 PM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]I'll be VERY interested in developments adelaidesp20.
Thanks for the heads-up :)[/color:post_uid0]

adelaidesp20
26-12-2002, 08:34 PM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]??? Hi All.

Have spoken to Mike from pacemaker and he will be getting back to me soon with the answer, unfortunately most contacts are on holidays at the moment.
Though... from info he has so far, the reason the engines blew on the test SP20's were not because of the headers but more than likely due to over heating in the engine on use of racing fuel or NOS, so the test cars may have been race track cars....again... will know more when hi tech header R&D come back from hols.

Merry Xmas and happy new year to all Astina/Protege fans.[/color:post_uid0]

Critter
28-12-2002, 06:26 AM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]Thanx moit :)

Eager anticipation....[/color:post_uid0]

TDK
15-01-2003, 01:21 AM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]Has anyone got any new info about the headers?[/color:post_uid0]

TDK
20-01-2003, 11:17 AM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]Hi Guys, here is the contact at Hi-Tech in Melbourne. He spent about an hour with me on the phone about why headers on the SP20 won't work. I didn't understand half of what he was saying, so give him a call and we might get some useful info.

[b:post_uid0]Contact at Hi-Tech Headers:
Duane
(03) 9312 5066[/b:post_uid0]

Good luck,
TDK[/color:post_uid0]

BigMal
20-01-2003, 10:02 PM
[color=#000000:post_uid1]Probably better to get the guy to email you and then you can
post it up here. That way all can read and learn and its not
a case of chinese wispers with people forgetting bits or not
understanding etc.

Regards

Mal[/color:post_uid1]

Toyboy
20-01-2003, 11:01 PM
[color=#000000:post_uid4]Just a quick question for Mal & Tony,whats the width of your 18's and what size tyres are you's running ???
I was looking at buying 18's but these particular 1's are only made in 18x8's :( Even the tyre centre is doubtfull that they will fit :( My dreams are smashed :angry:[/color:post_uid4]

BigMal
21-01-2003, 12:36 AM
[color=#000000:post_uid1]My 18"s are 7" but the old 17"s were 7.5".
Run 215/35/18 tyres. 8" would be a real tight
fit and would not be legal as its way over the
max optioned wheel width of 6.5" from the V6.

Regards

Mal[/color:post_uid1]

Toyboy
21-01-2003, 02:33 AM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]Yeah thought so Mal,the rims i want are only made in 18x8inch :( Damn Damn Damn,nothing is ever straight forward with this car :angry:
Thinking about coming to sydney tomorra to check out the wheels at Tempe,and a few other stores :;):[/color:post_uid0]

TDK
21-01-2003, 03:31 AM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]I don't think this guy would want to sit down and write an e-mail about something when he isn't going to get anything out of it. The reason I put this contact up is that 'adelaidesp20' was already in contact with Pacemaker and he also wanted to speak to Hi-Tech to get their side of the story.[/color:post_uid0]

TDK
22-01-2003, 09:19 PM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]I called Pacemaker in WA today. I spoke to Greg and he told me that IF they are going to make headers for the SP20 then it won't be in the near future.

TDK.[/color:post_uid0]

TDK
13-02-2003, 07:55 PM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]Hi guys. hasn't anyone got any new info about this topic. What is happening with the previous developments.[/color:post_uid0]

adelaidesp20
18-02-2003, 07:47 AM
[color=#000000:post_uid4]Hi All.

Sorry for not getting back to you all sooner, but with holidays and the like am now back @ work.

Spoke with Pacemaker (Mike Richter) today and he assures me that all is well but the final jig run of the headers is delayed until end of March (Thanks to the new ford and holden) which is takingup most of his time in R&D.
He has received many orders for the headers for our beloved car and he "IS" definetely going to do production of these as soon as he gets my test car onto the block and jigs made up etc...

The story so far is...... 8'500kms covered an trace of heating up the engine, or loss of power, or worsened fuel economy. Pacemaker have spoken with various "experts" including HiTech and there is no proof of engines blowing after 10,000km. Though HiTech were a little woried about attempting the removal of the primary cat and the positioning of the sensors as in the USA this has le to ECU warning lights coming on. At this stage my ECU is fine and no problems at all.

The only problem I have with the whole exercise is that the secondary cat is just that, a secondary cat and not big enough to clean emissions thoroughly so when the test header comes off and the final production run header goes on, I will certainly be adding a high flow cat to the system.

Am interested in going the hole hog with a 2 1/2 inch mandrel bend s/steel which I've been quoted $860 inc hiflo cat. Does this sound good ? Can anyone advise of the gains and loudness?

Will be calling back Pacemaker in the first week of March to book the car in for it's final date with destiny. But first my 40,000km service beckons. What a sweet ride we have.
:D[/color:post_uid4]

dfvadr
01-03-2003, 09:51 AM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]hi all you guys hows things cool this anyway answer to who ever ask about 18's on an sp yes i have an i have no probs with them an had to make no mods to the guards onto the header situation i was told extractors or headers would be a waste of money because the way the standed manifold has been designed u would recieve no advantages at the wheels an thats were it counts[/color:post_uid0]

adelaidesp20
09-03-2003, 10:04 AM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]Sorry odd12c, definite power increase. At least an extra 5-8 kw at the flywheel. not much but definetely noticeable.

A USA post on protege5 forum earlier last year mentioned something about replacing stock headers with a mandrel bend short headers system with equal length tubing but still keeping both cats, and aparently no gains were recorded. If you saw the photo of this design it wouldnt surprise me. It looked like one of those trick twist balloon animals that clowns put together at kids parties. Not sure how it fitted under the bonnet with all those twists, but it didnt need half a brain to figure that gains would be nil. Straight through design always works best. ???[/color:post_uid0]

TDK
26-03-2003, 01:37 PM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]Any new info?. I had an exhaust company call Pacemaker yesterday to ask how they were going. They said that they had someone testing them at the moment and that the tester was very happy with them at the moment. He also said that ii shouldn't be much longer before they start selling them. Adelaidesp20, are you the phantom tester that they mentioned. Have you got any new info?

Thanks,
TDK[/color:post_uid0]

TDK
04-04-2003, 09:01 AM
[color=#000000:post_uid0]It's been almost a month since anyone posted something about this topic. Is there any new info? Whats happenning with the extractors.[/color:post_uid0]

sabretooth
07-04-2003, 07:32 AM
[quote:post_uid0="-=SP20=-"][color=#000000:post_uid0]I know I can get everything but the pistons,cams & ecu in Oz.[/color:post_uid0][/quote:post_uid0]
[color=#000000:post_uid0]Haltech are Australian and have shut their US office down. I don't see why you can't get one in AU.

My MX-5 runs a Haltech E6A. My only complaint with it besides a few problems I'm having at the moment is that the idle is rough, and apparently that rough idle is a common trait with some Haltech installations.[/color:post_uid0]

TDK
05-05-2003, 03:42 PM
Has any one got any news on the extractors for the SP20?

ezin
15-07-2003, 08:15 PM
I hope one of u guys can work out how to get the mazdaspeed turbo kit over here for a good price! Totally not fair that america gets the turbo! I would have bought one! :roll:

kar10w
06-08-2003, 04:14 PM
hey all. interesting reading. i was thinking about getting headers too, but after reading the comments about headers, i'm now a tad sceptical about them. so to you sp20 owners out there (preferably in sydney), what exhaust system do you have in place (ie full or catback only, what have you done with the 2 cats) and was the increase in power worh the money?

adelaidesp20 (hi), what's the latest on the headers?

thanks guys.

Critter
06-08-2003, 09:49 PM
Latest on the headers is in another thread.....:) and it is looking promising.

I am using a simple cat-back atm, dunno about exactly what power it makes, but the improvement in throttle response is VERY worthwhile.

Was only $270 or something with a nice (mild steel) Magnaflow muffler.

kar10w
07-08-2003, 07:43 AM
you didn't need to go for a mandrel bent setup critter? i've heard you only need to go for a mandrel bent if there are lots of 90 degree bends in the exhaust tract. is mandrel bent or mild steel better for the sp20?

thanks.

JynX
07-08-2003, 08:10 AM
Mandrel bent is better then press bent as the exhaust maintains the same diameter through all the turns (regardless of angel). Press bends restrict the exhaust as the diameter is smaller in the bends. Press is cheaper as mandrel bending machines are very xpensive and big. Mandrel bent systems flow alot better.

The choice in metal is between Stainless or Mild Steel. Stainless supposedly wont rust so it lasts longer. I think it transfers heat a little better 2 but not 100% sure. Apart from that its cosmetic.

Critter
07-08-2003, 09:03 AM
The cat-back I am using is in fact mandrel-bent whilst being mild steel, doesn't have to be stainless to be mandrel-bent......there are pleny of mild steel zorst systems that last plenty long.

The Pacemaker headers use this "cone technology" thing which as I understand it keeps the flow open and smooth like a madrel-bent system without the exxy machinery. We will see....

Aaron
07-08-2003, 01:32 PM
I was under the Impression that Haltecs (Like Autronic and Motec?) Were Aussie developed ;0 that my have changed though...