Numbers

[Snert]

Hi Guys

Due to the incompatability of the 1/4 Mile Database to the forum (not through lack of trying, Thanks for giving it a go Enigma) & the interest in everyones Drag Times.

I am going to be tracking 1/4 Mile Times, At first the QLD Drivers (Hence the QLD Posting) but in the near future hope to expand to club wide.

Where I am at so far can be seen at http://snertspeed.pcroom.com/results.htm

It is a great help that you can enter your own times and just email them to me for a cut and paste.
Blank Sheets can be retrived from http://snertspeed.pcroom.com/blank.xls
Once completed just email them over to me snertspeed@pcroom.com
Also any suggestions, comments or complaints (minimum on these please)

Thanks

Kurt

[chicaboo]

How is it Greg is slower, but has a higher trap speed? More accelleration at the end of the track?

[LordWorm]

How is it Greg is slower, but has a higher trap speed? More accelleration at the end of the track?
Prob my rubbish 60foot times...
I had some trouble getting the launch rpm right.. it was either too low (good reaction time, but dragged the chain over the first bit of the track..), or too high (chirped 1st, and 2nd, and dragged the chain over the first bit of the track...)

[chicaboo]

Hey Kurt, you need to update your sig for your latest dyno results from the group dyno at Mercury. :p

[QuicKSilveR]

QuicKSilver KE18 18/09/2005 11:44am 23Deg 32Deg 32% 0.934 reaction 2.281 60ft 5.913 330ft 8.806 660ft 85.68 mph 11.226 1000ft 13.283 ET 109.30 mph

Turbo should go better on a Cold night and a 2.0 60ft time :)

[QuicKSilveR]

....Oh I e-mailed. Can I join in being a KE Laser (BF)

[Snert]

BUMP

Come on guys I remember seeing more than 5 drivers out there

[Nate]

ill pull out my old slips from last year ... i think i ran a 17.1 ... that was before MT

hopefully should see some mid to low 16's if i can get my launchs right on the 18th

[Ian]

I got a 15.007

Other facts I dunno... ask burbon, he was in the other lane. I dunno if I still got my timesheet.

[QuicKSilveR]

Its looking really good, but you need to but it somewhere o rmake it a sticky

[LordWorm]

should point the toyota boys at this too.. sure they'd like their stuff recorded for posterity :).. the day the lowly mazdas beat the sportivos...

[SILVABULLIT]

should point the toyota boys at this too.. sure they'd like their stuff recorded for posterity :).. the day the lowly mazdas beat the sportivos...


Or how about the day 1 drag prepped mazda beat a few street prepped Toyota's. :eek:

MMMM.... sounds more like it :p Cause I didn't see any other N/A Mazda's out there under 16.5secs???????? Cause if we go on averages for team as a whole the rest of you guys aren't backing Twilight up too well :( :p :p

[bourbon]

but what bout consitancy... i was constanly slow :p hahahahhahaha :D ill admit it... might not be proud bout it but im happy with how consistant i was... all 4 runs with in .300 of a sec and reaction times goin down im happy...

GRANNY SPEC for the WIN!

[LordWorm]

heres snerts times for the day...
25/02/2006 4:47:00 PM 27 33 58% 0.840 2.447 6.962 10.636 67.060 13.753 16.407 84.18
25/02/2006 4:52:00 PM 27 33 56% 0.846 2.534 7.005 10.659 67.730 13.772 16.410 85.45
25/02/2006 4:59:00 PM 27 33 57% 0.768 2.390 6.836 10.487 67.770 13.595 16.240 85.71
25/02/2006 5:16:00 PM 27 32 61% 0.883 2.316 6.731 10.395 67.390 13.517 16.174 85.02
25/02/2006 5:37:00 PM 27 32 62% 0.728 2.456 6.931 10.575 67.530 13.726 16.403 84.40
25/02/2006 7:31:00 PM 24 30 78% 0.703 2.490 6.973 10.662 67.240 13.789 16.450 85.03

all under 16.5 i think you'll find.

Lets just have this out. What advantage do you honestly think removing the backseats out of the car gave twilight? dont even talk about the centre console, it weighs nothing, and isnt even in his car when its in "full street trim". The removal of windscreen wipers was to be prepared if there was a strong head wind, but even if there was, do you think removing them would have done anything but stop them from flapping around? removing the rear wing...its made from fibreglass if memory serves... even so... we're talking about thousandths of a second advantage through aerodynamics there...

There was nothing stopping you guys from stripping out your backseats.. nothing at all. Shouldn't have taken long either..or been too hard to do. Removal of speakers and subwoofers seems like common sense to me given that they are not required to get down the quarter, and pulling out the spare wheel...well i did that, did that give me much of an advantage? given mazda claim the car does 16.6 stock, and i was doing 16.570 on my best run, and my car has a slightly modified intake and throttlebody, i'd say its neither here nore there.

The drag tires... how "drag" do you think they are? they are fully street legal, semi track tires that serve no useful purpose other then saving the rubber one runs on during hte day. If i had a spare set of wheels, i'd do the same. You would too. they were not slick tires. I'd even almost bet they wouldnt have better traction then some good soft compound street tires.

how bout giving him credit where credits due. Alot of engine work, tuning and hard work has gone into getting that car below 15secs. Loads of internal work, trial and error and so forth, and frankly its a bit of an insult to put his times down to the fact that he was in "drag trim". Smacks of sour grapes.

Ok we could have done everything on averages... but given we outnumbered the toyota drivers 2 to 1, we would have needed to pick out our best drivers to go against you, and when twilight's 14sec pass brought our average right down, you would have cried foul that we had more cars to chose from.

Hows about excepting that the better team won on the day. Without state of the art lift assisted engines, with lower power to weight (even with his insane weight reduction, the sportivo generates more power per kilo than twilights astina).. Yep ok most of us are not as fast as him. Whoopdeedoo.. if northy had of run i'd hazard a guess he would have wiped the floor with the other sportivos. Every team is allowed its stars..

I for one had a great day. and it seemed like the toyota guys were having a ball too. There was no comments about things being unfair until you all got back behind the relative saftey of your PCs and started flaming on the forums.

From day one we were told we wernt going to win. We all went there fully expecting to come away with second prize. I think the toyotas really thought it was theres to win, and when they didnt... well... pride comes before a fall etc.

Also, Bare in mind that fastest ET was only *one* award. There were plenty of other awards that had nothing to do with whos car went the fastest at the end. Terminal speed, 60 foot, burnout, reaction. All things the sportivos could have quite easilly won, despite going up against a "drag prepped" astina. Those awards were open to almost *anyone*.

So hows about we drop this "drag trim" "race tires" "removing windscreen wipers" "only twilight was competative and he cheated" rubbish. If you want to settle it, we'll settle it on the track next time. Work on your cars, show up and prove us wrong. Thats what its all about. You got beaten this time... how bout doing something about it next time instead of splitting hairs over nothing.



anyway... i've said my piece... i'm sure i'm only saying what others are thinking.

by the by, i'm still waiting on timeslips from the entire toyota crew that showed up so that i can do the certificates..

[LordWorm]

but what bout consitancy... i was constanly slow :p hahahahhahaha :D ill admit it... might not be proud bout it but im happy with how consistant i was... all 4 runs with in .300 of a sec and reaction times goin down im happy...

GRANNY SPEC for the WIN!
SLowest ET, lowest terminal speed, and worst RT whilst actually trying on all counts, goes to bourbon ;)

[chicaboo]

So did best burnout go to OSP200 or OSP180? I didn't see Andrew's burnouts in his car, but I was told he did a pretty decent one in my car. :p

I agree with Greg, everyone was well and truely foretold how Andrew was going to prepare his car!!!

[LordWorm]

So did best burnout go to OSP200 or OSP180? I didn't see Andrew's burnouts in his car, but I was told he did a pretty decent one in my car. :p

I agree with Greg, everyone was well and truely foretold how Andrew was going to prepare his car!!!
i think best burnout goes to the driver does it not?

I reckon andy in my car would go down for the funniest burnout.. wheelspin, bouncing around all over hte place and absolutely no noise cos of stock exhaust :P


you coming out on the 18th? i want a piece of SP18 without the professional driver :P

[bourbon]

YAY I WON SOMETHING :D :D hahahaha (actually no i wasnt worst reaction time...) ian was slower than me... plus it was our first times to drag... so dont make fun...everyone is new at something before they become good at it...

but in all good spirits...it was a great day...and i also want to see more of them happen :D

[LordWorm]

YAY I WON SOMETHING :D :D hahahaha (actually no i wasnt worst reaction time...) ian was slower than me... plus it was our first times to drag... so dont make fun...everyone is new at something before they become good at it...
wasnt making fun :P

my worst reaction time was 1.1 secs... (funnilly enough, it was my best ET that run...i think i had the best launch RPM that time, but took off late)..my best was 0.491....

was my first time out too =)

[Nate]

i think best burnout goes to the driver does it not?

I reckon andy in my car would go down for the funniest burnout.. wheelspin, bouncing around all over hte place and absolutely no noise cos of stock exhaust :P


you coming out on the 18th? i want a piece of SP18 without the professional driver :P

ill give ya's both a run :p

[chicaboo]

i think best burnout goes to the driver does it not?

I reckon andy in my car would go down for the funniest burnout.. wheelspin, bouncing around all over hte place and absolutely no noise cos of stock exhaust :P


you coming out on the 18th? i want a piece of SP18 without the professional driver :PYeah, but I provided the equipment to do such with, they give the prize to the racehorse don't they? :p

Yeah, I was just talking to Nate about it, if I take a whole lot of weight out of my car and run in "race trim" it MIGHT make a slight difference to my times. Actually it will be interesting to compare the differences considering all the silver bull**** that has been touted about the subject. Ummm, I still weigh ****loads and am easily still heavier than "street trim" car with a normal sized driver I might point out...

[LordWorm]

ill give ya's both a run :p
your on!

beware though! i'll be pulling out my backseats this time... fear my insane weight reduction drag trim stock protege [/sarcasm]

[Nate]

its your red nose gav... its loosing you valuable seconds!!

[Nate]

your on!

beware though! i'll be pulling out my backseats this time... fear my insane weight reduction drag trim stock protege [/sarcasm]

but bro ... ill have my full race suit ;) 25 kw at the wheels! :p

[LordWorm]

but bro ... ill have my full race suit ;) 25 kw at the wheels! :p
thats it!...i'm going down to supercheap and buying a full set of completely irrelivant decals for my car... you know the ones that have "NOS" and "NX" on exactly the same sheet?

i'm sure a HKS sticker will give me turbo powa!

[twilightprotege]

i vote best burnout for my burnout in gav's car. at the lights there was still tyre smoke coming out of the engine bay!

i'm staying out of the "twilight cheated" bs conversation because i jsut dont give a flying fark. i'm not going to change the way i race my car. no point. that's how i race and that's how i'll always race. you can even see my car in the exact same setup on the 18th (tnt) and then the 25th (mini-jam).

[twilightprotege]

i think you need TuRD stickers

[LordWorm]

i think you need TuRD stickers
haha we should make up some "TuRD" stickers i reckon! :)

custom inflamatory decals :P

while we're at it.... we'll do up a "Gav, I told you 2.5in exhaust was right" for your backwindow once hte new header goes on ;)

[Nate]

"but i have a turbo" for ian :p

sorry mate had to do it :p

[chicaboo]

Argh, 2.5"? You guys won't even touch the sides! :p Anyhow, I'll buy your LordWormlightprotege cat-back if it's done in 2.25"...

[LordWorm]

Argh, 2.5"? You guys won't even touch the sides! :p Anyhow, I'll buy your LordWormlightprotege cat-back if it's done in 2.25"...
turns out 2.5 is about right given the power i'm going after.. Spoke to the CES exhaust guy on saturday.

all the work is done in the collector (apparently)... which tapers up from like 2in to 2.5.. after that you just gotta get the gas out as quickly as humanly possible.

bigger the pipe, less restriction.

Yeh theres the velocity side of things.. but hte way the collectors are designed they accellerate the gas outwards pretty violently if my understanding is right (and i only have limited understanding)... at 2.25 flow is the problem, not velocity..it chunks up and you get loads of backpressure. Twilight will clarify if i'm wrong here.

why dont we design a 1.8L full exhaust for ya ;) the length of your primarys is... well small :P mine will end up somewhere under the shifter i think :P (33 odd inches long)

nate: i'm sure we could come up with a fancy quote for just about everyone if we think about it... i'll leave it upto you to work one out for our toyota friend ;)

[Nate]

kida like when i eat hey gav :p ... i too will be chasing a tworm racing exhaust, 2.5 inch complete system ... gotta relocate the radiator first to the dark side, i mean outside of the support panel ... you guys keen?

[LordWorm]

kida like when i eat hey gav :p ... i too will be chasing a tworm racing exhaust, 2.5 inch complete system ... gotta relocate the radiator first to the dark side, i mean outside of the support panel ... you guys keen?
good grief...we havnt even designed the one for the BJ yet and already orders are rolling in :P

we're going after the "Money is no object" approach.. outright power... if thats not a problem for you :)

Speak to the man with the welding gear and knowledge... he'll hook you up with a table showing what kinda power you might wanna make...and take it from there.

We're also looking at doing injen rip off and complete custom cold air intakes (they are much easier to design and should be quicker to knock out...) if anyones interested :P - big expense here is the pipe work .. need to get turbo places to bend the appropriate diameter aluminium tube... because noone in bris seems to do it we need to go interstate... should be able to undercut price wise anything you could import tho...

[chicaboo]

The 1.8 can't pump as much air as the SP20, we worked out it needs another 750-1000rpm to do the same job and make the same power. But then again it can rev atleast that much more.

If you guys want ultimate power and quietness on the back of that fancy 2.5" xorst, consider the OBX or XForce 2.5" inlet twin-loop setups.

Incidently my power went up 9kW (that I can reach before revcut) from a 2" axle-back. However the power range feels as if it has moved up entirely. Food for thought...

[LordWorm]

The 1.8 can't pump as much air as the SP20, we worked out it needs another 750-1000rpm to do the same job and make the same power. But then again it can rev atleast that much more.

If you guys want ultimate power and quietness on the back of that fancy 2.5" xorst, consider the OBX or XForce 2.5" inlet twin-loop setups.

Incidently my power went up 9kW (that I can reach before revcut) from a 2" axle-back. However the power range feels as if it has moved up entirely. Food for thought...
yeh

1.8L would be a completely different system i'd imagine.. i'd supose the header would be the same (the 2.0L is just a stroked 1.8 isnt it?), but the collector and exhaust would prob be 1/4" narrower or more.

Quietness isnt an issue...well it is a bit..power first...the things look like they are going to be completely inhouse designed and manufactured now (premade collectors would prob bump the retail of the completed header up considerably...)

Let us build the pair for the worm mobile and OSP200 and we'll go from there ;)

[Nate]

good grief...we havnt even designed the one for the BJ yet and already orders are rolling in :P

we're going after the "Money is no object" approach.. outright power... if thats not a problem for you :)

it wont be once nat dat gets out of the yard! 2.5 will suit me nicely, im aiming for a 9000rpm limiter so its all good

[LordWorm]

it wont be once nat dat gets out of the yard! 2.5 will suit me nicely, im aiming for a 9000rpm limiter so its all good
cool

i'm pretty excited about getting the first one on my car... research into just what it might do is quite drool worthy...but i'll save details for when its built and we have dyno facts to backup theory and speculation :)

[Nate]

be there on the 18th! we need to talk ;)

[LordWorm]

haha i'll do my best mate. I honestly do plan to be there, female unit in toe.. trying to con her to take the SP20 for a blacktop showdown against someone :P

be good to meet you seeing as you piked on the only 2 meets i've turned up for yet! haha

[twilightprotege]

the more i look into it, the more and more the header does all the work. the tail pipe is purely means to get the gas out. too small and it'll lose power, too big and you're just wasting money, but wont lose power.

2.25" system will limit you to 200hp at the engine NA with the correctly designed header

[LordWorm]

the more i look into it, the more and more the header does all the work. the tail pipe is purely means to get the gas out. too small and it'll lose power, too big and you're just wasting money, but wont lose power.

2.25" system will limit you to 200hp at the engine NA with the correctly designed header
do we know where the 2.5 tops out?

200hp wont cut it for me...

[twilightprotege]

i did see it somewhere, but no NA 2L engine will get to it

[LordWorm]

i did see it somewhere, but no NA 2L engine will get to it
ahh cool....so its open ended effectivly.. will do more then i'll ever require it to do... good to know :)

[SILVABULLIT]

Lordworm man take it easy you'll blow a gasket. I'm not having a go at twilight for doing what he did. His car is quick and I'm not negating that. AS for others running under 16.5 apologies to those who did it. Didn't see your runs or have read anything about your times. Congratulations. None of the Toyota crew knew it was a given to gut your car for a test and tune. WE turn up, race, then go home. That's it.

Not remove all things that are relatively easy to take off, disconnect etc. As for for your claims about tyres being of no benefit that's utter BS. Obviously you need to learn about how tyres actually work and the difference in compounds and side wall structures etc. If they're not that different from ordinary street tyres why not run them all the time?

Anyway we did have fun despite what you think or may have thought or conjured up but honestly the vibe we get from Mazda owners is that "Twilight" will smash the Toyota's so we win.... Ok he was quicker no gripes here but the rest of you who do more talking the talk than walking the walk(as far as we're concerned Twilight is the one doing the walking and top marks to him :) ) he's not carrying on just doing his thing his way. WE had no idea it was going to be that serious otherwise we may have looked at doing the same to create some sort of "parity".

Afterall it was meant to be a "comparison" of sorts. If Northy's car was running it would have been as he drives it everyday to work etc etc.

Toyota owners are more than happy to continue having combined meets of sorts as you start to get used to looking at the same type of car(I know I do from time to time :) ) and it's sometimes good to see how people who own other makes of cars modify them and customize them to a degree. But lets just make sure that if there's another meet of this type that rules(if there's any) are clarified to a degree to keep the "fun factor" right up there as it's like turning up for a race meet and forgetting to put the race car in the trailer and having to run your tow car..

Again not having a go at Twilight for his method of drag racing cause if I was that serious about it I would have more mods to my car than that to chase that elusive tenth of a second to win. :)

So there you go kids that's my thoughts on the matter. Like it or lump it :)


On the exhaust system chat be aware that what you've mentioned about pipe diameter doesn't really make any difference if you go bigger dia is wrong. N/A engines are very very tempremental when it comes to diameter as it directly does have an effect to the amount of backpressure created as well as muffler choice. If the 2.0 engine your putting them on doesn't rev harder than high 7k's then 2.5 will be too big. As you've mentioned about header length and diameter be aware that these 2 factors affect where you make your power. If you want it to be peaky then run short primaries or long ones for torque. But don't go too big in pipe diameter straight up as even that can knock the bottom end torque out of your power curve. Hope this helps :)

[LordWorm]

Lordworm man take it easy you'll blow a gasket. I'm not having a go at twilight for doing what he did. His car is quick and I'm not negating that. AS for others running under 16.5 apologies to those who did it. Didn't see your runs or have read anything about your times. Congratulations. None of the Toyota crew knew it was a given to gut your car for a test and tune. WE turn up, race, then go home. That's it.

Not remove all things that are relatively easy to take off, disconnect etc. As for for your claims about tyres being of no benefit that's utter BS. Obviously you need to learn about how tyres actually work and the difference in compounds and side wall structures etc. If they're not that different from ordinary street tyres why not run them all the time?

Anyway we did have fun despite what you think or may have thought or conjured up but honestly the vibe we get from Mazda owners is that "Twilight" will smash the Toyota's so we win.... Ok he was quicker no gripes here but the rest of you who do more talking the talk than walking the walk(as far as we're concerned Twilight is the one doing the walking and top marks to him :) ) he's not carrying on just doing his thing his way. WE had no idea it was going to be that serious otherwise we may have looked at doing the same to create some sort of "parity".

Afterall it was meant to be a "comparison" of sorts. If Northy's car was running it would have been as he drives it everyday to work etc etc.

Toyota owners are more than happy to continue having combined meets of sorts as you start to get used to looking at the same type of car(I know I do from time to time :) ) and it's sometimes good to see how people who own other makes of cars modify them and customize them to a degree. But lets just make sure that if there's another meet of this type that rules(if there's any) are clarified to a degree to keep the "fun factor" right up there as it's like turning up for a race meet and forgetting to put the race car in the trailer and having to run your tow car..

Again not having a go at Twilight for his method of drag racing cause if I was that serious about it I would have more mods to my car than that to chase that elusive tenth of a second to win. :)

So there you go kids that's my thoughts on the matter. Like it or lump it :)


On the exhaust system chat be aware that what you've mentioned about pipe diameter doesn't really make any difference if you go bigger dia is wrong. N/A engines are very very tempremental when it comes to diameter as it directly does have an effect to the amount of backpressure created as well as muffler choice. If the 2.0 engine your putting them on doesn't rev harder than high 7k's then 2.5 will be too big. As you've mentioned about header length and diameter be aware that these 2 factors affect where you make your power. If you want it to be peaky then run short primaries or long ones for torque. But don't go too big in pipe diameter straight up as even that can knock the bottom end torque out of your power curve. Hope this helps :)

Look sorry for going off a bit... just seems that you guys were one way on the day (no gripes) then another when all was said and done. I'm still waiting on slips from your crew (just the times etc as you gave me will do) so i can get the certs done up. terminal speed is about the only one i'm not 100% on.

as for tires..my understanding is he runs them on the track only to save his street tires getting chewed. If they were race tires, they would be illegal on the road methinks (slicks certainly are)... and look at his history of times on snerts site, then ask him about what time he started with drag tires, you'll see there isnt much difference/improvement in his 60 foot time.

Anyway, i'm just as happy as anyone to drop this whole thing. Guess i have a short fuse..and was only saying what alot of people were thinking. I enjoy spending time with the toyota guys...you guys have some nice rides and are great to hang out with.

Next time out i'll be a little more oganised. Planning to open it up to give the FI guys a chance to win some awards (in a different class, obviously..though some categories they could run with the NA guys and it'd be evenly matched, such as RT etc)

as for the exhaust...talk to your mate trevor...we're repeating what he told us. at applications at or exceeding 200hp at the fly (where i'm going to), you're at a cross over between exhaust sizes. Better to go larger and have the headroom, then go with 2.25 and be slapped with a 210fwhp ceiling. 2.5 basically exceeds the requirements of any NA 2.0L mazda motor, and thus is the choice. - the trick is in the collector. next time you are down at CES check out their race collectors. Where the 4 primaries merge, the collector tapers in, to a narrow diameter (say for arguments sake 2in), then over a distance of say 6in it flanges out to the 2.5. My limited understanding and 5min research into how/why this works tells me that the gasses are compressed in the merge point, creating an area of high pressure. The 2.5in exhaust it thus a lower pressure area, and you get a suction effect. Basically puts the scavenging effect on roids. We were both pretty stumped when trevor said "go 2.5in"...but seems he knows his stuff. and at this stage its where we are going unless investigation points us elsewhere.

Once again i apologise for going off. and for not organising the rules of the comp better. i still honestly think there is very very little in the weight reduction and tires but hey... you get that.

See if you can rustle up the slips. We have best of and worst of awards to decide.

[chicaboo]

Twilight had mentioned on OMC how he was going to run his car, I guess everyone assumed that since Silver and Northy posted on the 2 threads about it there, that they were well aware how he preps his car for TNTs and meets.

I think if the 15 odd people on the Rolla forum that said they were going to attend, did actually attend, that the results would've been more comparable. As it was we had 3 110ish kW Sportivos with more power than every single NA Mazda there only running against twilight. I got there late, but there were no regular Rollas to run against anyhow.

Oh well, you are now being fore warned that I am preparing my car for the next drag meetings I attend. So if your regular rollas ever attend a meet, they can do whatever they want knowing this, but considering I weigh as much as 2 people, I don't think parity is ever anything that can be fully achieved. And I will be insulted if anyone ever said to me my results mean nothing because I took my seats out...

Gav.

[SILVABULLIT]

Lordworm I've sent my best ofs already. If you (can't remember if It was you or somebody else) didn't get em send me a PM and I'll put em through again. I'll hurry up the other guys as well. As for the exhaust stuff you'll obviously being doing a lot more than Twilight to get over 200 at the fly. What rev limit are you gonna run? That in itself could crop a HOLE new set of problems as Northy found out!!! But yeah if DR Trev says that's what you may need it's the go but be choosy with what sort of muffler/resonator combo you go with as they in themself can bring you unstuck and cause the horrible problem of the "4 cylinder twin cam drone and cackle". Good Luck!!

[LordWorm]

rev limit... 7500 to 8000... it'll happen after a full rebuild with forged pistons and new barings (rest of the motor is tough as nails and should take it without worries). thats up from a 6500 rpm rev limit.

ITBs are where the extra power will come from. Plus the header is an honest to god completely unknown quantity, because its never ever been done.

Resonators, 2 inline highflow thingybops. Cat will be a magnaflow, muff and tip will be a straight through 4inch jobby (fits snuggly under the rear bar)

at this stage we're looking at an aluminium exhaust system, HPC coated to make it take the heat...will be light as a feather but prob have a really tinny sound about it. Glasspacked muffler will solve that.

the exhaust will be hella short. I think the merge will end under the shifter somewhere.. the cat will prob be inline with the front seats, then 2 resonators...not really talking a massivly long exhaust!

Given andy already has a 2.5in system, we'll prob test it on that first. That way nothing lost. if 2.5 isnt impressive, we can try for 2.25 on mine.. but the 200hp cap is the big evil with 2.25. need the extra headroom if i'm going to get 130kW at the wheels.

[twilightprotege]

Exhaust - as stated, not according to trevor @ ces. Silva what you're confusing is a system where a collector is poorly designed or have no venturi "choke" in the collector, then the rest of the system makes a big difference because the rest of the system acts like the venturi part. A correctly designed merge collector has the venturi at the end of the header thus making the end of the header (almost) the end of the exhaust system. Also, you might want to check up on your use of backpressure. I cannot say this more enough, but NO exhaust system wants backpressure. Backpressure = severe loss of power. Backpressure is the most incorrectly used term in motoring.

Racing - I'd happily run my car down the track in full street trim if you like - if someone pays me - otherwise it's just a waste of my time. However something that might be more interesting is for all corolla boys to do whatever the hell they want with their cars in terms of weight reduction, then race against me. I'd happy take up the challenge. At the end of the day I don’t "race" as such. I just want to get down the end as quickly as possible. Hell racing at jamboree I had no idea about the croud or anything. I just concerntrate on the lights. With about 50m to go I finally look at what the other race car is doing and decide if I have time to brake or if I need to keep going. Actually, the first time I look at what the other car is doing is the raction times when they show on the board. Gives me a good indication if I have time up my sleave or not. But still I stick to my previous posts that weight reduction is a mod and nothing more than a mod. Nothing different than a new exhaust or bigger cams. All it does is improve my power to weight ratio.

Tyres - I use them to get consistant launch times as well as a smaller rolling diam to get a slight gearing advantage. Like I've said, my best 60ft time with my toyo street tyres was 2.142. my best with the drag radials is 2.060. Certainly not a huge gain, but I can do 2.100 60ft's all day long where the street tyres were a bit over the shop (even up to 2.5 seconds). As with all dyo racing, consistancy wins races not speed. If I could get consistant times all day long with the street tyres I would stick with them.