Very Serious Issue with the BJII :( :( :(
 

Hey ppl,

I was out driving the other day in the hatch. Long story short, some incompetant asshole managed to get me irate. I very rarely loose my temper, but this guy was a total FW.

I hit the gas on the car pretty hard- small amount of aggressive driving- about 5 mins later- its starts to loose power. Sort of juttering- with the revs going ape. I assumed the fuel meter was off a few notchs from when i reinstalled the dash, and that i had run out of fuel.

So i headed for nearest service station- I thought my luck had changed- as soon- and i mean- as soon as i pulled up to the bowswer- the car dropped out.

So i fill it up, about $10- just enough to get home- about 10 mins away. It seemed to be ok- but still off.

Now this is #@*%$ up bit. It was raining. As i came out of round about -there was a large puddle- probably about just above ankle height- so i mean it was still a puddle- not a flood- just a big ass puddle- if that makes any sense.

The very moment i drove over the puddle- BOOM- everything- and i mean everything just dropped out. No power, no electrics. the lot.

2 months ago, i was doing some work, and had to remove the plastic fender wells on the front of the vechile. I couldnt get the damn things back on by myself- have limited equipment- and only really the car jack in the rear-. So i was nagging my pa about arranging to put these back on.

Day after day- i kept sayin "really gotta get those fender wells back on". Day after day- all i got was bull**** excuses.

Now here is the fcked up bit. According to RACQ staffer, he believes the INGEN CAI- has SUCKED UP FRICKEN WATER- into the motor- and the whole flipping thing has HYDROLOCKED- IE: entire motor is rat****.

Upon opening the CAI- there was water inside the piping- definatly- but when turned upside down- it was small dribble- the rest was mostly moisture around the AIR SENSOR.... and some further moisture inside the piping leading into the motor.

Now im hoping for the fricken life of me, that this is not the case. One important thing the RACQ staffer overlooked- is that the car DROPPED OUT- PRIOR! to going over that puddle. It then ALSO dropped out again immediatly going over the water.

So if it was HYDROLOCKED- who would this explain it dropping out before hand- prior to ANY water actually going up into the induction piping.


The last 3 or 4 months, i have neglected to have the car tuned. Mostly, i have not been able to afford it- i am still a student. What i did notice recently was a loss of power, and general sluggishness, and i knew the spark plugs were well overdue for replacement. The oil- i always change, and the water i always check- but as for other maintence- nothing has really been done.

When the RACQ staffer- tried to get it to turn over- i smelt electrinic burning coming out from near the ignition.


I know there are some extremly knowledgable people out there, if anyone has ever had this scenario of their vechile just dropping the hell out- after aggressive driving.

I feel like strangling the incompetant, power-tripping retail manager that got me fired up in the first place. Believe me on this one- this guy was a right asshole- would fire anyone up. Usually is never a issue for myself.


So at the moment- the BJII is off the road- possibly HYDROLOCKED- or mabye not. I am sure as hell hoping i am not up for a entire new engine :(


EDIT: Just come inside- I removed the CAI complety. There is WATER. About two tea-spoons sitting on the outside of the valve. I got a piece of sponge and held it there to absorb it.

I am only hoping because of the instant shut-down- it was almost instant- that there is no serious damage. Either way this is REALLY fcked up. What kind of TRAP is that? Stick a giant fricken water sucking device at the very bottom of the damn car! What the hell are INGEN designers thinking?

having a CAI is why you don't drive over "puddles" when it rains
what you drove over isn't a f'ing puddle... it's FLOODED.... you're not the first one to tell this kind of story, I have seen it many times over the years, and each time the person said he just drove over a "puddle"

you should've known better not to drive in the rain especially since you no longer have the fender liners... injen assumes you have it still fitted in place but they still have a disclaimer in the instructions that they're not responsible for engine hydrolock

anyone who drives a car with a CAI has to drive responsibly and wisely, knowing that they can't drive in very wet conditions, otherwise they risk engine damage... don't like the thought? don't get this style of CAI... there's other solutions out there!

the burnt smell could be an overloaded/overheated starter as it cannot turn an engine full of water... you can try to take out the spark plugs, disable the fuel pump, then try to turn the engine over which will expel the water from the cylinders..... I recommend a rag over the spark plug holes as it will make a huge mess on the bonnet.... if the engine turns freely after this, then you are lucky.... all you need to do then is change your oil, get new spark plugs and the engine should be good to go

YOU NEED TO PUT THE FENDER LINER BACK ON

As Ed said take all your spark plugs out and pull the fuel pump fuse and try turning the car over. If its hydro locked water will come flying out the spark plug hole when you try to start the car.
When I hydro locked my car I had to completely submerge the pod filter to do it.
After firing all the water out I managed to get the car to start again. Albeit with something bent inside the engine.
Check all your fuses and relays are in as I hit a huge pothole once and it knocked the fuel pump relay out of the fuse box and caused the car to die in the middle of no where.

Had this happen a couple years ago with my old simota cai, by having the pod filter exposed to water coming off the tyres, it soaked the pod to the point where water has sucked up tbe intake, and tripped the maf sensor... my advice would be to clean out the maf and see how you go from there...

Yep, had this happen with my Injen. Flooded road but thought I'd be OK (guessed the filter was above the water level) and babied it through as slow as I could. Well it cut out and I had to jump out and push the car to the side of the road.

Pulled the pipe off and drained a cup of water out of it. Didn't have a spark plug spanner to take them out. Managed to get it going again after about half an hour of cranking in short bursts with some time in between for the starter to keep cool. Ran very rough a few times when I did get it started (and conked out again) but eventually dried up and ran a treat. I guess I was lucky and all I was really suffering from was wet spark plugs and odd readings to the ECU from a wet MAF as I was just idling. I'd follow the advice in the posts above.

Fingers crossed you haven't bent anything.

If you get it started and she's apples I recommend a precautionary oil and filter change.

there is a reason why they call them splash guards. it's an electrical issue. look under the bonnet and find whatever electrical item is wet, and dry it out.

May sound really stupid and simple. But check your fuses if you smelt burney electrical. They'll pop first.

First take a air gun, go to every book and cranny you can think of and blow it out. Blow out the inside of your spark plug wells as well as your coils/dizzy, unplug all the leads and blow out the connectors, blow out all electrical connections you can see (remember, engine and your lack of wheel linings could have splashed water anywhere) look at everything electrical and dry it. Then check the fuses. Then remove the plugs and crank it, if you get water splashing, out, lets hope it isn't much. And it should be good, unless you seriously bent something. But usual hydrolock literally just freezes while running, that or something cracks, but electrics shouldn't be effected
Also don't listen to the racq ppl, they usually don't have a clue, I have had a friend almost sell their car because the engine was "flooded" according to racq road assist... I came over, cleaned out the electrics with air and lookee here it started.. Fan fine for years after..
Also what tools are you refering to to fit the linings? I thought its just pushpins and a few screws?
I have racq to be able to tow my car for free in case of emergency.. I'm not changing a wheel on the side of the road, not with careless drivers we have here

Firstly, thanks for the advice here. I don't trust the mech- already telling me it is ceased- up for $2600 to $5500. Reason I do not trust them- is the dude sounded so ****ing pleased to tell me the news. You know? Did not even try to let me know possibly alternatives- so the vibe I get is they don't give a **** about trying to purge it - wants the cash.

It was really low revs- and it shut down immediately- they cannot get it to turn over.

Again- cant thank you ppl enough-appreciated..



The mechanic tried to turn it over. Said he had no luck. Was able to "turn it back and forth" a little, but would not turn over.

He has said it would likely be the "conrod"- and if that went so would the "timing belt"- and there is "no cheap way out of it"



Otherwords he is writing the entire engine off.


How could this be the case, I mean if others here have endured much worse in terms of water? The water itself was No higher the ankle-height- reason I went through it- is I had no choice- I was in the middle of turning around a roundabout- coming out of the round-a-about was directly in front of me- the water- I would have had to stop- at the end of the round-about to not go through it.

My own intuition, and according what I have read here, and on Wikkipedia- is that it should not be damaged in the way he is describing.

The water was shallow- the car shut down immediately. Wikkipedia states- if hydrolocking occurs at low-power- that it is purgable- via expelling the water.

What could be causing this "back and forth" business they are talking about ?

I know for certain these mechanics have not worked on Mazda's before- they said so themselves last time.

This is what has me concerned. I don't trust either RACQ or this mechanic. Your right- it did just FREEZE- instantly- I was barely going 10kms! and it went dead 3 metres after the puddle.

I cannot see how this can cause the sort of damage he is claiming. My intuition is sounding alarms all over the place.

Would it really have bent the rods- if shut down straight away- with almost no throttle- and covering no distance (4metres at move) basically the other end of the bloody mini flood/puddle whatever the fkc it was :(

Phil, when you say something bent inside the engine ? How much did it cost you to have it replaced and repaired ? Did you have to scrap the entire motor?

I didn't even look at repairing the POS 1.8L as it had low oil pressure issue as well as it was starting to burn oil.
I chose to replace my engine with a FS-ZE from a Mazdaspeed Familia and also chose to do the ECU swap at the same time.
I looked at reconditioning it but it was cheaper to import a used motor and install it than repair it.

You should be able to tell if it has a bent rod just by looking down the spark plug holes. rotate the crank, if it cannot be rotated properly, then it is damaged the bottom end. If it does rotate properly, then look at the pistons and see if one or more does not reach the height of the others, ie slight bent rod.

3 seconds is a long time. Even at 750 rpm idle, the pistons cycle 12.5 time a second. At speed and for 3 meters, who knows how many cycles it had?

If you dont trust the mechanic, the get him to perform the test/s in front of you. Or do the tests yourself under his supervision.

The prices he has quoted are insanely high. It should cost (Engine price)+($1000) to fit. And that'll include a new water pump and timing belt.

Dunno what engine it is, but a FP can be brought for $500-$700 from wreckers. And if a FS, then there is a few members on here that have spares.

Thanks Phil..

Thanks heaps Project!!

What is the go with using a large metral rod/ piece of pipe- too try to turn it over? Both the mech and RACQ have done this ? Does this even work?

This is the only method they have tried.

Its only 1.8 (astina BJII 2003 hatch)

Thats what I would do to text the rotation of the crank. Attach a socket and breaker bar to the front crank bolt, and pull.

I just flicked over to EBAY--
BJ II ENGINE only 90,000 KMs - $459

I'd only need someone who knows what the hell they are doing to fit the damn thing.

You don't know what that engines like.

Don't blame injen for your own mistakes and given how weak our rods are and how well water compresses. It's not hard to imagine :)

Try a diff mechanic. I used to use one in Caloundra overall really happy :)

EDIT: You need to think about this logically take a step back and make a plan of attack.

Most engines are about 900 dollars, with that youd want to replace plugs, timing belt (depending), water pump (again depending) if you factor that in with the cost of the engine + fitting you do end up around 3k. So stop bad mouthing the mechanic he isn't ripping you off exorbitantly.

Again, step back and make a logical plan of attack. Try fixing what you have before spending money that you don't have apparently.

Ok so if it did turn out to be a connecting rod, why the hell would he suggest writing the entire engine off. I just looked on Ebay - there are replacement connecting rods available? Why the fck- would he not just suggest to have this replaced?

Any idea of the difficulty involved in replacing connecting rods ?


Your right- I do need to think clear- my guess now is the Ebay BJ engine would be a 1.6 :(


Ice- does this mech have any experience in replacing rods ?


I don't believe the engine needs to be flipped off- because of a bent rod.

I can buy replacement rod.
Replacment MAF sensor
and Starter motor

Speak to Phil he has parts in his back yard

I will swap affected piston / rod or swap motor for you only problem is I am about one hour from you - tow it to me it will still work cheaper for you.

20 years with Mazda + 4 ZE swaps - Scott's motor going in today