choice of engine oil

[derb]

Fine, 0W40 in the next change. Is that OK with you?

[SLY 323]

Heres what i use just for reference;
06 Mazda 3 SP23 with 40000ks ; 5w30 Castrol Edge
96 Mazda 323 1.8 with 180000ks ; 15w30 Castrol Synthetic
85 Mazda 323 1.6 with 300000ks ; 20w40 Castrol GTX

As my cars become older and more worn ill use thicker oils.
If i run anything thinner in the older cars i do notice much more oil being burnt off and having to add oil on a more regular basis so i use these oils for my specific cars needs.

[TheMAN]

I have about 80000km in my sp23.... it uses 0W30 castrol syntec with 16000km oil change intervals... climate here is as hot as Australia in summer but does get pretty cool in winter... no problems whatsoever... runs smooth as baby's bottom, zero oil consumption

[TheMAN]

Originally Posted by SLY 323

Heres what i use just for reference;
06 Mazda 3 SP23 with 40000ks ; 5w30 Castrol Edge
96 Mazda 323 1.8 with 180000ks ; 15w30 Castrol Synthetic
85 Mazda 323 1.6 with 300000ks ; 20w40 Castrol GTX

As my cars become older and more worn ill use thicker oils.
If i run anything thinner in the older cars i do notice much more oil being burnt off and having to add oil on a more regular basis so i use these oils for my specific cars needs.

for your 85 BF, try switching over to Valvoline MaxLife synthetic blend 10W40
I use this oil with my 93 corolla with over 350000km on it... when I first bought this car, I burned almost a litre (and leaking oil) every 5000km running GTX 10W30... so then I switched to GTX High Mileage 10W30, it was a little better but oil leaks still persisted... once I switched over to Maxlife blend 10W30, the leaks stopped after a few weeks and oil consumption went down to about 500ml every 5000km... I've since gone to Maxlife 10W40 and I haven't looked back since! Oil consumption is only 1/4 of the dipstick now every 5000km, improved over the 10W30.... the fact that it's also semi-synthetic let's me safely extend the oil change intervals to at least 8000km with a peace of mind

Castrol GTX oil is an old tired brand... there's nothing special about it and there's nothing great about it... it's just your average oil... the MaxLife here costs only a few dollars more and has much better antiwear additives, have more detergents, have more seal conditioners, and is inherently thicker over most cheap oils while still staying within the range that constitutes what advertised grade it is

I used to be a GTX fan myself, but after studying oil analyses of both the GTX and the Maxlife, the hard facts were clear... the Maxlife is one of the best cheap oils for older cars (it is one of the few "high mileage" oils in the market)

like I said... give it a try... I'm pretty sure you'll get good results with it, and your fuel consumption will probably improve with the lighter weight oil too... which is great in this day and age where petrol prices are expensive

[project.r.racing]

Originally Posted by SLY 323

Heres what i use just for reference;
06 Mazda 3 SP23 with 40000ks ; 5w30 Castrol Edge
96 Mazda 323 1.8 with 180000ks ; 15w30 Castrol Synthetic
85 Mazda 323 1.6 with 300000ks ; 20w40 Castrol GTX

I use:-
07 Mazda 3 2.0L 80,000km = 5W40 per 10,000km
97 Mazda 323 1.8L 180,000km = 15W60 per 5000-7500km (depends on laziness)

[SLY 323]

Originally Posted by SLY 323

Heres what i use just for reference;
06 Mazda 3 SP23 with 40000ks ; 5w30 Castrol Edge
96 Mazda 323 1.8 with 180000ks ; 15w30 Castrol Synthetic
85 Mazda 323 1.6 with 300000ks ; 20w40 Castrol GTX

As my cars become older and more worn ill use thicker oils.
If i run anything thinner in the older cars i do notice much more oil being burnt off and having to add oil on a more regular basis so i use these oils for my specific cars needs.

Just to add, I service every 5000ks. Only due to the oil always being so dirty. Still trying to find out why. My old Pulsar for the first 3 services were filthy, and after that the oil whenever I changed it looked like I had changed it yesterday, never figured out what I did, but with that car I was doing it right!

[mynameisdaniel]

Originally Posted by SLY 323

Just to add, I service every 5000ks. Only due to the oil always being so dirty. Still trying to find out why. My old Pulsar for the first 3 services were filthy, and after that the oil whenever I changed it looked like I had changed it yesterday, never figured out what I did, but with that car I was doing it right!

My car was the same, 5,000km and it was black. I just put it down to using the car for lots of <5km trips.

[DavoAust]

Originally Posted by mynameisdaniel

My car was the same, 5,000km and it was black. I just put it down to using the car for lots of <5km trips.

Agreed, short trips are hard on a car. It doesnt get warm enough to burn off the crap in the oil.

Daniel: I assume you're changing the filters at the same time? Mazda's always seem small compared to fords equiv for the same engine.

[TheMAN]

Originally Posted by SLY 323

Just to add, I service every 5000ks. Only due to the oil always being so dirty. Still trying to find out why. My old Pulsar for the first 3 services were filthy, and after that the oil whenever I changed it looked like I had changed it yesterday, never figured out what I did, but with that car I was doing it right!

No offence, but the oil gets dirty because the detergents are doing it's job cleaning the oil! Think of it another way... would you rather have a clean air filter after driving many miles or a dirty one?

one old habit that dies hard... "change the oil when it's black"... that's an urban legend because there is empirical data behind that the oil has gone bad... in fact, some brand new oils come out of the bottle brown and it doesn't take long for them to look dark after it's been used (Mobil1 and Red Line comes to mind)... but does that mean it's already bad? NO! The only true way to determine this is with an oil analysis which determines the amount of minerals in the oil, viscosity, diluted fuel, other particulars, and the alkalinity level of the oil... based on many many oil analyses from the past 5 years, oil changes on a mechanically fit engine (even with lots of miles) do NOT need to be less than 8000km

I used to think the same way, but the fact that I spent my time reading up on the new ways and keeping my mind open allowed me to do three simple things:
-Save money by changing the oil less
-Protect the environment by changing the oil less
-Save my time by changing the oil less (who doesn't want to be lazy? )
All of which done safely without compromising the mechanical integrity or life of my engines

Just like the "thicker oil works better" mentality, the 3000 mile/5000km oil change interval mentality must die.... these ideas are of more than 25 years ago and times have changed... oil quality has greatly increased, and in fact some good quality mineral based motor oils almost equal the quality of synthetic oils from 20 years ago... yes, technology has improved that much!

Ask yourself another question... when was the last time you saw an automaker recommend oil changes every 5000km for cars used in developed countries? Many now recommend a minimum of 8000km and in many cases 12000km, using high quality dealer supplied/approved oils. You can even easily go twice that with high quality synthetic oils and filters in order to equal costs and save time!

This 3000 mile myth dies hard, and was really promoted in the US by "quick lube" service centres who tried to make a quick buck... they now have stopped this and gone to 5000 mile (8000km) recommendations to any of their customers stupid enough to go to their shops. In fact, California recently launched a campaign to educate and rid of the 3000 mile oil change mentality in order to reduce crude oil consumption, something I agree with and admire for once!
http://www.checkyournumber.org/about/
that is a US site run by the State of California, but it has some informative pages and gives you some ideas about oil change intervals

If you really want to keep your engine clean, switch to a higher quality brand of oil... get a diesel rated engine oil that is also rated for petrol engines... these oils are formulated more robust, have loads of antiwear additives and detergents... they are also a little on the thick side for whichever grade you buy (this resists mechanical shearing, fuel dilution, and oil consumption better).... look on the bottle for something like API SN/CJ-4... API "S" service categories are for petrol engines, while "C" are for diesels... if you see both on the same label, they are designed for both... DO NOT run diesel only oils... they have too much detergents and will cause sealing issues with the piston rings... and in Australia, you ought to encounter lots of labels that show ACEA ratings... look for the A3/B3/B4 label... the A3 and B3 ratings are important for high performance, long drain intervals use, while the B4 rating are for passenger car diesels... the German made Castrol Syntec 0W30 is one oil that meets all these standards as well as VW, Mercedes, GM, and several other manufacturer specific oil standards, which ensures that it can withstand the toughest road (not race track) environments

like I said... do some research and experiment a little... your wallet (and back) will appreciate it!

[mynameisdaniel]

Originally Posted by DavoAust

Agreed, short trips are hard on a car. It doesnt get warm enough to burn off the crap in the oil.

Daniel: I assume you're changing the filters at the same time? Mazda's always seem small compared to fords equiv for the same engine.

Yeah, I always changed the filters too. I was using the one listed for the 626 with the FS-DE, the filter for that is almost twice as big as the tiny one that's recommended in Ryco books etc.

I was using good quality oils, although maybe a little thicker than I should've for so many short trips. I'm guessing they cleaned the engine pretty well seeing as the oil got so black

[SLY 323]

Not seeming like an enviromental pig or anything though i will probably stick to the every 5000ks service for peice of mind and it seems to look good to potential buyers in the log books. :-)

[TheMAN]

it's your choice and your money, but it's proven unnecessary... 8000km gives the same peace of mind... and that's a very conservative interval nowadays!

[project.r.racing]

Okay, here are the product I've been using:-

Penrite 15w60 177.0 cSt @ 40C, 24.3 cSt @ 100C (Motorsport Mazda 323)
Penrite 05w40 92.0 cSt @ 40C, 15.0 cSt @ 100C (A to B Mazda 3)

Cannot find data on @ 150C for the products I have been using. But looking at the Redline Oils data Edwin supplied, @ 150C seems to be a third of @ 100C? Y/N?

Is 24.3 cSt too thick for regular operating temps for a BP engine?

Other products I may consider changing to:-

Penrite 10w50 127.0 cSt @ 40C, 19.0 cSt @ 100C
Penrite 00w30 64.0 cSt @ 40C, 11.4 cSt @ 100C

64.0/11.4 cSt just too thin for any above applications?

I have also heard the outside temps effects operating temps by up to +/-10C? Or will the thermostat combat this? But what if on the track the car is sucking 60C temp air, making under the bonnet hotter than normal etc?

Or is it just when it is really-really-really hot, like say 40C or more that it will effect operating temps. QLD has averages of 22-32C all year round, with a few lower increases/decreases of 10C a couple a days a year.

[phildough]

Im running castrol edge titanium 5-40 and my car loves it, it has not burnt any in 8000km and still looks nice and clean.
It will be changed soon after I fix my car.

[TheMAN]

Originally Posted by project.r.racing

Okay, here are the product I've been using:-

Penrite 15w60 177.0 cSt @ 40C, 24.3 cSt @ 100C (Motorsport Mazda 323)
Penrite 05w40 92.0 cSt @ 40C, 15.0 cSt @ 100C (A to B Mazda 3)

Cannot find data on @ 150C for the products I have been using. But looking at the Redline Oils data Edwin supplied, @ 150C seems to be a third of @ 100C? Y/N?

Is 24.3 cSt too thick for regular operating temps for a BP engine?

Other products I may consider changing to:-

Penrite 10w50 127.0 cSt @ 40C, 19.0 cSt @ 100C
Penrite 00w30 64.0 cSt @ 40C, 11.4 cSt @ 100C

64.0/11.4 cSt just too thin for any above applications?

I have also heard the outside temps effects operating temps by up to +/-10C? Or will the thermostat combat this? But what if on the track the car is sucking 60C temp air, making under the bonnet hotter than normal etc?

Or is it just when it is really-really-really hot, like say 40C or more that it will effect operating temps. QLD has averages of 22-32C all year round, with a few lower increases/decreases of 10C a couple a days a year.

there is no 150 degree testing on viscosity as SAE J300 and ASTM D445 doesn't specify it

5W40 is on the thick side for the Mazda3 and is unnecessary... the MZR engines were engineered to run on 5W20 oil (with some "acceptable" consumption), but really works best on 5W30 or 0W30 oil... 11.4 cSt is pretty average for a 30 weight oil... try finding a 30 weight oil with 12 cSt... it is in the upper acceptable range for 30 weight oil (but below what's considered 40 weight), which is better against heat and shearing... the Castrol Edge 5W30 a damned good oil (with some characteristics of its 0W30 A3/B4 not sold in Australia):
http://www.tds.castrol.com.au/pdf%5C...31_2011_09.pdf

the thick oil will cause higher oil temperatures (testing has been done by MX-5 owners in Arizona), high pumping losses, and possibly additional oil pump wear because of extra load on it... if anything, it may also cause the oil filter to open its relief valve most of the time, which means no filtered oil!

so I don't recommend the 10W50 in the BP... the Penrite 5W40 looks pretty good, better than the Castrol Edge 5W40 and 0W40 it appears (but those look decent as well)


your engine temperatures never goes lower than the thermostat temps... it can only go higher, and that depends on how well your radiator and fans work... but in any case, the 5W30 will be fine in the 3, while the 5W40 will be fine in your BA

remember, you want to go as thin as you can without:
-causing oil consumption
-causing oil to shear "out of grade" to a thinner oil
-causing oil to be diluted from fuel
-causing additional wear
-causing oil to overheat and turn to sludge

those oils I mentioned should NOT cause any of those problems... going thicker than that is just silly and cause inefficiency in your motor

[TheMAN]

Originally Posted by phildough

Im running castrol edge titanium 5-40 and my car loves it, it has not burnt any in 8000km and still looks nice and clean.
It will be changed soon after I fix my car.

I bet you will have no problems changing at a conservative 12000km.... and that's what I'd do if I were you... if you have faith, go 16000km

[project.r.racing]

Originally Posted by TheMAN

your engine temperatures never goes lower than the thermostat temps... it can only go higher, and that depends on how well your radiator and fans work... but in any case, the 5W30 will be fine in the 3, while the 5W40 will be fine in your BA

remember, you want to go as thin as you can without:
-causing oil consumption
-causing oil to shear "out of grade" to a thinner oil
-causing oil to be diluted from fuel
-causing additional wear
-causing oil to overheat and turn to sludge

those oils I mentioned should NOT cause any of those problems... going thicker than that is just silly and cause inefficiency in your motor

thanks!

both cars get 7.5L per 100km fuel comsumption, which is better than OEM specs when new. so not effecting engine preformance me thinkz?

main concern i have is previously i use Castrol GTX 15W40 in my BP/BA 323 , and it had oil consumption of 1000ml per track day. granted it is a crap miniral oil. hence i went the better Penrite HPR15 15W60, over 7500km + trackdays, it loses 500ml of oil. HPR15 was semi-synthetic at the time.

the 3s oil goes in maroon semi clear colour, comes out the same. 12,000km changes no different. this car rarely sees 4000rpm, and has short and long trips.

[TheMAN]

like I said earlier... I do 16000km changes in my 3 using syntec 0W30... the MZR engine is very easy on oil

realise that the GTX you were using may have sheared down to a 30 weight oil after that pounding at the track, so that made matters worse...

one important thing I haven't mentioned is that older engines (especially if you're not the original owner) tend to have varnish built up in the piston rings, which causes them to bind and not freely push against the cylinder walls easily... this causes additional blowby, which in turn causes oil consumption

there's 3 ways to fix this... only one of which is guaranteed:
-rehone the cylinder walls and replace the piston rings.... run in the engine again
-do a gentle slow engine flush with a couple of treatments of AutoRX using mineral oil
-do a quick engine flush using BG Quick Clean (did that, made some difference), with a degree of risk that you may dislodge some sludge and cause it to plug up an oil gallery

after the varnish has been removed from the ring packs, you can then safely run dual rated (diesel/petrol) or "high mileage" synthetic oils which have high detergents that prevents this from happening again

[phildough]

Originally Posted by TheMAN

I bet you will have no problems changing at a conservative 12000km.... and that's what I'd do if I were you... if you have faith, go 16000km

Brain says no.... the thought of 12,000 km intervals would have scared the crap out of me not so long ago!

[TheMAN]

not a problem at all with 12000km and synthetic with today's latest and greatest oils, especially when your engine is non-turbo

want to safely get 16000km life out of it? Install the UK spec factory oil cooler