Caboose 2.0

[maztech]

Get the Torque Wrench checked !

[TheMAN]

you either heilcoil a stuffed hole and use the same size bolt as original, or you make the hole bigger and use a larger bolt... you don't do both!

[Clean_Cookie]

As ed said, you use existing bolts with Helicoils. When was the wrench last calibrated. Should be checked annually or 6monthly if used every day. Always leave it untensioned too!

[Mad Mat]

Originally Posted by maztech

Get the Torque Wrench checked !

Originally Posted by Clean_Cookie

As ed said, you use existing bolts with Helicoils. When was the wrench last calibrated. Should be checked annually or 6monthly if used every day. Always leave it untensioned too!

We only used the wrench to nip up the bolts at the start. As the manual says.. Tighten the bolts to 17.5-22.5nm (i had the wrench set to 20) then do to runs of 90 degree turns on the bolts. For this i used my 1 meter breaker bar and a degree wheel.

Both the bolts snapped at the 60 degree mark on the second 90 degree run

So i don't believe a brand new wrench would be to blame.

[Ice88]

Originally Posted by TheMAN

you either heilcoil a stuffed hole and use the same size bolt as original, or you make the hole bigger and use a larger bolt... you don't do both!

Apologies. Meant helacoiling those two holes and using bigger bolts in the other holes. Less expensive option and should work just as well. Shall see what happens all depends on thread condition etc.

Originally Posted by Mad Mat

We only used the wrench to nip up the bolts at the start. As the manual says.. Tighten the bolts to 17.5-22.5nm (i had the wrench set to 20) then do to runs of 90 degree turns on the bolts. For this i used my 1 meter breaker bar and a degree wheel.

Both the bolts snapped at the 60 degree mark on the second 90 degree run

So i don't believe a brand new wrench would be to blame.

Dunno man.

[TheMAN]

Originally Posted by Ice88

Apologies. Meant helacoiling those two holes and using bigger bolts in the other holes. Less expensive option and should work just as well. Shall see what happens all depends on thread condition etc.



Dunno man.

less expensive? are you daft? different size bolts have different tensile strength! you either go larger on all or you stay the same... why do you want to get something larger with unknown metallurgy? It will either snap horribly or stretch horribly and won't be able to hold the cylinder pressures properly and warp the **** out of the head!

you still haven't told me specifics of what fasteners you used
I now have two new questions for you... whatever you were using, were they new or used? did you add lubricant to the fasteners before installing them?

[Simon]

Did you use new head bolts? Also, there doesn't really look like there is enough thread (from the block) on the bolt to look like it has stripped the thread. Have you tried cleaning out the threads with a tap? I've had a similar problem before and it turned out I just needed to clean out the threads in the block.

[Ice88]

The bolts that were used, where brand new stretch bolts that were in a sealed packet. We used oil to lubricate the threads

Regarding the bolts, it was a suggestion the end shop had. That's been utilized before for a few engines they've had that had stuffed threads.

tbh man, what solution I go with is based on what the engine shop suggests based on there findings. There reputable company here whom assemble lots of engines, granted doesn't mean they cant make mistakes but they sure as hell have more knowledge and experience then me and will take there suggestions under advisement. They've been nothing but awesome to deal with, granted they took there time and I paid for them to assemble my engine but still *shrug*

Originally Posted by Simon

Did you use new head bolts? Also, there doesn't really look like there is enough thread (from the block) on the bolt to look like it has stripped the thread. Have you tried cleaning out the threads with a tap? I've had a similar problem before and it turned out I just needed to clean out the threads in the block.

Yeah mat did that before we torqued the head down. And that's what I thought as well, only conclusion I could come to is that there wasn't much thread there to begin with perhaps *shrug*

Will find out soon enough. Will be taking the engine in on Wednesday

[Simon]

Maybe check the length of the bolt, I've generally only ever snapped bolts when they have bottomed out.

[TheMAN]

WHICH brand of bolts? I'm trying to help you and you're not helping me by not providing specific information?

[Ice88]

There an Australian brand of bolt called Nason

[TheMAN]

how much you paid for those? how come I have the feeling they are the wrong thread pitch?

for something so important like this, there's zero reason to cheap out... either get the genuine mazda head bolts or get the ARP head studs which are cheaper and better!

[Ice88]

Originally Posted by TheMAN

how much you paid for those? how come I have the feeling they are the wrong thread pitch?

for something so important like this, there's zero reason to cheap out... either get the genuine mazda head bolts or get the ARP head studs which are cheaper and better!

Cant remember. Bought a few things with it, studs are months old.

The studs are for an FP/FS, marked on box. Granted wrong studs can be placed in the box but that isn't a risk unique to Nason.

The mechanics I used to work for used Nason bolts on all sorts of stuff without any problems *shrug*.

[TheMAN]

if the studs have different thread pitches on each end, then installing the wrong end in will fail

STUDS ARE NOT BOLTS
you tighten studs differently than bolts... a different method is required!
you only tighten bolts per the shop manual

[Ice88]

Uh. I seriously fail.

Replace studs with bolts in my last post. :/

[TheMAN]

how much did you spend on the bolts?

[Ice88]

As I said previously man I don't know.

Bought head gasket, studs and something else.

[Ice88]

Edwin picked it. Bolts were incorrect, they were to short and to small in diameter.

****s me cause I double checked that box when I bought it and checked it after we stripped the threads. Wrong bolts in the box. If I'd had bought an entire engine I would have had a stud that I could have used to compare of course but had no such thing.

*sigh*. Either way works progressing solidly, should hear back regarding the engine start of next week.

Couldn't sleep last night, and based on maths I did valve clearance will be close. Still not sure how the compression ended up out of spec?

EDIT: Words cannot describe how pissed off I am atm. Im pretty easy going most of the time, but I loathe ****ing up. Other then doing things properly its the one thing that will **** me off in no time at all.

[DVS]

I know the feel of getting wrong parts in the right box or recieveing wrong ones a supplier had given you. One thing I have learnt is to double check things beforehand but you had nothing to compare it to which sucks. Hopefully you get it sorted without many dramas.

[Ice88]

Stupid me forgot to send the cam gears and timing belt on Monday. **** thing is I need to get home collect the gear and get to aus post before it closes.

Or alternatively leave work really early. Neither case are doable at this point in time, too much work, same with the small holiday I had planned in Oct.

On a side note, not sure whether I'll be able to finish the engine + swap. I have holidays coming up in February for a week and then meant to be going overseas for 5-6 weeks in April... Need the $$$ for holidays.