Coilover suspension vs. Replacement suspension parts

[project.r.racing]

Originally Posted by Noble323

Ps: i hope no one quote's this reply.

Okay, I'll make sure no one quotes you okay, oops too late! jkz

The reason there is so much quoting is that Andy, Gav, Greg(1), Greg(2), Dan and I, and anyone else I've forgotten have many views and ideas on what is the best set-up for a car. We've all raced cars, we are in various stages of building cars.

Two of us (Andy and I) are alpha males and are quite dominate and competative also, (on and off the track.) We don't see eye to eye most of the time. And I know he doesn't think much of me. Personally I wouldn't care much also but I am unhappy that is has to be that way.

But I do admire him for his competative nature and his willingness to give it a go. Racing is a hard life. And many a spanner can be thrown into the works. He is achieving his goals and getting a few wins along the way. Unfortunately, he dies not respect other racers or up-and-coming racers or wanna-be racers. You got to start somewhere. Once you are in the scene, you need to be a role model for others. I am sorry Andy if you am not like this. It's just a vibe that is out there and I'm not the only one feeling it.
(Please Andy, do not take this as disrespectful towards you. As I have said before, I admire your racing nature.)

It's sometime good to have a heated question and answer like what has happened on this thread. I think all questions have been answered, different views and options have been exhausted. Have a nice day.

Ryan

p.s. now you can flame me boyz!

[Noble323]

I see it like this after reading and from other friends:

Coilovers : are great - you have everything in it without adding much to it, i would say most race cars would use them only cause i see its easeier to work with - abit to much $$$ but if i had the money i'd maybe wouldnt still buy them.

Adjustable Socks & Springs : i would say it will do the same (using good brands) as the coilovers, but maybe the coilovers would be easier to work with and maybe has more things on it (like that top thing, dunno the name) and comes as a complete set.

Just Shocks & Springs : simple & normal & with proformance as well - also i would say its as good as the others when you know the height you want, cause once its in, its in, and will cost to change - thats probably the only bad thing about them, but its normal and with a good brand will help.

As for me im really after looks & if it helps with handling a bonus for me, so i might go for the adjustable shocks & springs - i would go for the normal shocks and springs (and still might) i just want 18'' and lowered about an inch maybe (hopefully not more) and the springs sitting in without moving once car is lifted up (example : on a jack etc..)

Like i said this is how i see it.

[illusivedreams]

I have used peddars Lowered (RED) springs (sports rider i think) with the average gas shocks and the preformance difference was magic....

Cost $500 springs all 4
Shocks $400 just front 2.

Very few of my friends could stick with me especially the heros in the WRX's.

In so Most of the $2000 Coil over sets are great if your going to make use of it..Ie on the track.

On normal roads in Sydney or Australia where do you need to corner at 150km/h? to trully appreciate the difference..

[pr1mo]

astina Vs wrx lol

[Rupewrecht]

Originally Posted by deejayryry

It's sometime good to have a heated question and answer like what has happened on this thread. I think all questions have been answered, different views and options have been exhausted.

Agreed. You did say yours were fubar and i forgot that - my bad. I'm man enough to admit it - not saying you aren't mr alpha male

But you don't know how many race cars i've raced/been in either

[LordWorm]

I am just saying things don't always run by the book, a la Wormlets best time being a very untidy example of what you call a good launch...!

Gav - not my best time anymore... I was getting much the same times with no spin... granted my new pb was a big smoke up due to complete lack of traction off the line, cold track and what not, but for I consitantly run faster with the "perfect" launch.... If i had of nailed the launch on my last run, it would have been quicker i believe....

Once my tyres bite, my revs drop rather sharply....so i dont think i get any powerband advantage by doing it.

End of the day, right or wrong, consistancy is key.... you cant *consistantly* get the same amount of wheelspin every time because its a loss of control over the launch... so you may or may not go faster in the end....but you wont be able to duplicate it over and over again.

[LordWorm]

Originally Posted by Astro Boy

Haha... i get it.. joke... right? Your seriously beleive that by making a shock harder your car all of a sudden gains more kilo's????

no....i dont believe that. I was suggesting you would get more force down over the front wheels is all... obviously wrong in this department as its already been answered...BUT....you dont get as much lift apparently so its all good.

[project.r.racing]

Originally Posted by Rupewrecht

But you don't know how many race cars i've raced/been in either

Now my bad - sorry Dan.

[twilightprotege]

problem with being offline for a few days is so many replys and so many that needs replying to.

first of all, gav - wtf has died up your arse? man you have just gone off your nut!!!! your posts have been way over the top
- spinning wheels means that your engine is putting it's power into tyre smoke and not to moving the car forward. just because your car has less power than the next guy doesnt mean this fact is any different. as i said, the clutch is the key to good times. check my 60 ft times in your car vs your 60 ft times.
- RC cars are just a little different to real cars on a drag strip
- stop calling me, greg, everyone "farkers" etc. it's getting quite rude
- how could you compare a suspension setup for "loose sand or dirt" to highly prepped bitumen with lots of added on goodies?
- soft suspension setup on the front means that the front will lift easier (even if the back is solid). lifting the front off the ground means less weight over the front and loss of traction. ofcourse the online crx is going to skate and jump all over the place. it has done a best of 10.6 or something (done at compak attak). serious power there trying to get to the ground. if the suspension was soft it would be worse. do you honestly think that if a soft front end yielded better times, everyone wouldnt be using it? this is another reason why fwd drag cars use wheelie bars. keeps the front firmly planted on the ground - minimising the front lifting. basically anything you can do to stop the front lifting is worth the effort.

greg (astro) - points always well put! (and i like your interpretation of the rally rules that allowed you to go to +14 degree caster (or whatever nate said it was). caster rocks!)

ryan - yeah that's the problem with people with the same personalities. either they get along, or conflict.
- it's not that i dont respect up and commers - i'm just trying to share my experience. sometimes i'm just not good at explaining poop.

me - go to bed. you've driven over 2000k's over 3 days with a day full of racing in the mix.

[project.r.racing]

***UPDATE***

Had both front and rear strut braces fitted and rear 20mm sway bar fitted 1 week later.

Front strut brace - improved steering response and handling, improving corner speed in and out of corners.
Rear strut brace - made the rear end feel heavier, sticking the rear axle to the ground, improving all round corner speed.
Rear sway bar - didn't do much improving, but does allow you to oversteer alot giving better turning.

With much of the chassis flex removed due to strut braces, the suspension's stiff springs now feel alittle hard at first but now used to it. Without the chassis flex to absorb some of the stiffness, you can feel it alot more in your seat. To the point of being a little annoying on big dips/bumps etc.

The rear sway bar was a let down for me. Many people suggested a massive handling increase - but I found it was only a little increase. To get the full potential out of it I would have to change driving styles and that would not be safe unless on a track.

But adding the strut braces and sway bars have really increased the handling of the car.

I would recomend a rear strut brace to anyone that doesn't have one already as I found this was the biggest handling upgrade other the the coilovers.

Ryan

[twilightprotege]

strut braces rock! my rear brace made a huge difference once it was installed. makes great improvements in cars like ours since that is a large open area where the car will flex a lot. sedans have it a lot easier in that respect...

[LordWorm]

I have a little rear flex in my sedan..but not sure if thats mushy stock springs... either way, i'll be running a rear strut brace under the parcel shelf for extra reinforcing and flex removing...

Bummer bout the sway not improving that much :\

[project.r.racing]

cheers guys, yeah i was dissapointed in the sway bar, but in all honesty, it was an improvement.

if i wasn't running a kick arse coilover system, then i might have noticed bigger gains maybe ??? dunno ???

but in all honesty, i am really happy with the turn out, i have issues with corner out traction though - damn ****ty "F" series LSD does nothing to help - and castor rods might help too.

ryan

[LordWorm]

Originally Posted by deejayryry

cheers guys, yeah i was dissapointed in the sway bar, but in all honesty, it was an improvement.

if i was running a kick arse suspension system, i might have noticed bigger gains maybe ??? dunno ???

but in all honesty, i am really happy with the turn out, i have issues with corner out traction - damn ****ty "F" series LSD and castor rods might help too.

ryan

I spose if you were running less stuff.... the sway bar might have been more of an improvement? Could not some of the things you have done be doing some of the things the sway bar is there to improve?

I spose any improvement is a worthwhile improvement.... And I'm sure once you get used to it all you'll start using its advantages, without even knowing it.....then one day you'll pull it off and go "oh THATS what its doing!" =)

[project.r.racing]

i have chased a 97 wrx and it couldn't get away - looked like only having lowered springs etc. so that is a good start i think, a good benchmark to start from as i see them as handling kings.

What you said is true Greg, one day i will pull it off, i can change my driving style okay, back and forth so i'll just do what i gotta do. and the i'll say " oh THATS what its doing!" =) lol jkz

ryan

[LordWorm]

wasnt suggesting you'll pull it off... was more or less pointing out that its probably one of those things you dont notice what good its doing till its gone =)

but yeh

now you got the handling sorted...time for more POWER!

[project.r.racing]

Originally Posted by LordWorm

now you got the handling sorted...time for more POWER!

yes it is, time to push this bugger over the 100kW mark again, 80/85 just don't cut it anymore, althought its all being transferred to the ground very well now

intake + ecu need to be redone again for starters.

[LordWorm]

Originally Posted by deejayryry

yes it is, time to push this bugger over the 100kW mark again, 80/85 just don't cut it anymore, althought its all being transferred to the ground very well now

intake + ecu need to be redone again for starters.

intake eh?

should be able to help you out with a look at the prototype in a couple of weeks =)
100kW at the wheels would be much fun...

[project.r.racing]

if i can do something with the pistons - i'll be hoping for 110/120 at the wheels + maybe 30 shot :P also, we will see yet huh?

[LordWorm]

Originally Posted by deejayryry

if i can do something with the pistons - i'll be hoping for 110/120 at the wheels + maybe 30 shot :P also, we will see yet huh?

Knife edge and cross drill the crank, light weight rods (titanium goodness) and go spastic with your redline =)

Overbore the block too ... yes =)

not sure how crazy you wanna go... but any bolt ons we can build (and obviously sell to other people to make it worth our while...), let us know... always interested in new ideas etc =)